PINNED - Lithium battery conversion/info

[Burgerman]

No. They are 175 tall. You want 200.
They are 200 long. You want 175...

[expresso]

https://m.rj-lithium.com/sale-11538651- ... orage.html

these someone posted here - 6000 cycles and should fit

it dosnt say how tall or wide - just the numbers - i assumed the 200mm is high - if its the other way around - then no wont fit

[daunjan]

https://m.rj-lithium.com/sale-11538651-portable-3-2-volt-200ah-lifepo4-battery-cells-li-ion-lfp-battery-for-home-energy-storage.html

these someone posted here - 6000 cycles and should fit

it dosnt say how tall or wide - just the numbers - i assumed the 200mm is high - if its the other way around - then no wont fit

Full spec sheet is here...just click description... https://m.rj-lithium.com/sale-11538651d-portable-3-2-volt-200ah-lifepo4-battery-cells-li-ion-lfp-battery-for-home-energy-storage.html

[expresso]

thanks - i didnt see that either - i was actually answering two questions but as usual i got it confusing -

i was talking about those cells - but also the other link i posted - which dosnt show the size correctly - and i assumed the higher number was the how tall they are - instead it may be the width instead - but it dosnt say - just numbers -

thanks for that - i did want to see those specs also

[Burgerman]

That listing you linked is a reseller.

This is the actual owners site.
https://www.rj-lithium.com/sale-1153865 ... orage.html

And I just had a word with them on chat.

And I copied and pasted it.

*******************************

ME. Can you give me the HEIGHT of these 200Ah cells please? Your dimensions appear to be wrong. And the width. Please measure an actual cell.

>>> 202mm without poles, Plus poles height it should be about 208mm

ME. And the width. Because the pics show it is longer than it is tall. So something is incorrect. These must fit inside a specific battery area.

>>>D54mmxW174mmxH208mm. This is the 200ah Cell size

ME. I can see that on the page. The image shows that they are longer than they are tall...

>>>I will send you real product pictures

ME. OK finally, I will be using a very accurate cell balancing charger. And it can measure capacity from 3.650V to 2.5V at any C rate I choose. What is the REAL capacity I will see?

>>> More than 202ah

ME. Real pics to burgerman@wheelchairdriver.com and a price for 8 shipped. Thanks!

>>>Nominal capacity is 202ah Yes, will send all the information to your email

ME. And are these badly tapped by you? I have seen many cells recently. Some are tapped, very bad threads... Not even straight! And not the Ah capacity claimed.

ME. Shipped to the UK, best price, in 1 month.

>>> We will drill the thread hole for you, will drill exact M6 thread hole

>>> Yes Will send

ME. I will test capacity.

>>> 202ah. At least 202ah

ME. You can garantee this?

>>> Yes.

>>> We will measure the cells capacity and match in a group before leaving factory

[daunjan]

How about these ones Expresso 200ah fits specs... https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000398221441.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.371b71abkyH3jE&algo_pvid=51c1662f-9461-4808-8895-b58f08db2fd8&algo_expid=51c1662f-9461-4808-8895-b58f08db2fd8-1&btsid=0be3743615818206727723159e8a66&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

[daunjan]

Hey Burgerman how did you get them respond quickly... I messaged them twice for 105ah n 200ah to New Zealand today, haven't heard back... For quality they got 10yr most just 1yr guarantee...

[Burgerman]

For 8pcs 3.2v 202ah LiFePO4 Cells, USD114/pcs, sub total USD912
Shipping fee to door: USD314 including all taxes and import duties
Delivery time: 15-20days

RJ Lithium.

Thats under £1k , pounds delivered, all duty / tax paid up front. So no bill from the taxman.
For 200Ah lithium that fits my Salsa. And thats around 5.2x the range of lead. And around 7 to 10x the lifespan.

For 5x the amount of fuel as a set of MKs.
So you would need to buy 10x MK grp24 batts. That would cost 2.5K, wont fit, and weigh 600lb! And last around a year and a half.

Will be ordering a set of those for march. Spring. Ready to go a long way!

[expresso]

thanks for the links - not looking to purchase yet - always like to look and find some -

[Burgerman]

I used the online messaging, instant reply, and they eMailed me the details, price etc.

They did sign up here too a while ago. So you can contact them memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=4894

[daunjan]

thanks burgerman much easier, almost brought from BMS but once saw steves above post re bad screw thread gonna stay away... Not gonna buy wrong twice ha...

[Burgerman]

Just did a dollar/pound conversion online.

1227 US is 925 UK pounds. Including all taxes and shipping. Thats not bad. I will order. I like round numbers.

200Ah, delivered for 925. This lithium continues to get bigger and cheaper every few months. These were the 176 Ah sized cells at xmas...

[expresso]

Ok i also got a quick email - and basically] same info as you got BM - costs shipping etc, some photos how they test them - and pack them

my cost was 1 dollar more than yours each cell few dollars more shipping but nothing major - sounds great - i may need another 200ah pack

[ICEUK]

>>> We will measure the cells capacity and match in a group before leaving factory

All my cells have a sticker on them hand written with the capacity, like 105.3. Next one might be 105.2 or 105.0. Etc

[Burgerman]

The only way to do that is by discharging to 2V and charging to 3.65. Which they dont like. You can end up with high self discharge cells.

But at least they seem to try. I would rather they tested to 2.9v and marked them for self discharge levels. And impedance.

But you cant really complain at the price.

[rickystyx]

Don't forget in your price calculations that most banks will make a charge for sending a different currency - I got caught with that and it added about £30 to the price - I still got 8 cells 150Ah for about £630 so I was happy enough.
I've done a bit of research on my ballance leads too and see that the correct connector to the PL8 is a JST-PA connector, so now I can make my own up and will do when the bits arrive but I also looked at the specs from JST and those connections are only meant to do up to 30 connections maximum - worth noting if you use that little plug for making your chair connections. I'll be leaving mine connected semi-permanently so not too worried. It's because the little crimps inside the plug are made of tin coated brass so they lose the spring pressure on the contact with use.

[Burgerman]

The cable stays mostly on the charger. The Revolectrix connectors are better quality than most. So no contact issues hopefully.

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... DCABLE.jpg

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... nector.jpg

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... le-40A.jpg

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... -pl8v2.jpg

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... nector.gif

[Burgerman]

Don't forget in your price calculations that most banks will make a charge for sending a different currency - I got caught with that and it added about £30 to the price - I still got 8 cells 150Ah for about £630 so I was happy enough.

Pay with paypal.

[steves1977uk]

Don't forget in your price calculations that most banks will make a charge for sending a different currency - I got caught with that and it added about £30 to the price - I still got 8 cells 150Ah for about £630 so I was happy enough.
I've done a bit of research on my ballance leads too and see that the correct connector to the PL8 is a JST-PA connector, so now I can make my own up and will do when the bits arrive but I also looked at the specs from JST and those connections are only meant to do up to 30 connections maximum - worth noting if you use that little plug for making your chair connections. I'll be leaving mine connected semi-permanently so not too worried. It's because the little crimps inside the plug are made of tin coated brass so they lose the spring pressure on the contact with use.

Don't forget the pin-to-pin pitch size which I *THINK* is 2mm, but BM or Shirley will correct me if I'm wrong.

Steve

[Irving]

Don't forget in your price calculations that most banks will make a charge for sending a different currency - I got caught with that and it added about £30 to the price - I still got 8 cells 150Ah for about £630 so I was happy enough.
I've done a bit of research on my ballance leads too and see that the correct connector to the PL8 is a JST-PA connector, so now I can make my own up and will do when the bits arrive but I also looked at the specs from JST and those connections are only meant to do up to 30 connections maximum - worth noting if you use that little plug for making your chair connections. I'll be leaving mine connected semi-permanently so not too worried. It's because the little crimps inside the plug are made of tin coated brass so they lose the spring pressure on the contact with use.

Don't forget the pin-to-pin pitch size which I *THINK* is 2mm, but BM or Shirley will correct me if I'm wrong.

Steve

JST-PA is 2mm pin pitch. The connectors and housings are cheap enough, but finding the right crimp tool is more tricky. They are almost impossible to solder as they have to be crimped closed to fit in the housings. Also be aware, if you are making an extension cable the male (with pins) are intended for board mounting. If you solder wires to them you need to hot glue/heatshrink the wires to the body of the connector else the pins can push-back in the housing giving dodgy connections. Revolectrix do a JST-PA to JST-PA 36" extension (when in stock, which isn't often the case in my experience) that uses a board at the male/pin end.

[rickystyx]

Thanks folks - I've got the right things coming and also saw that these things need to be crimped before any attempt to solder them if that's what you want to do but the heat of soldering may soften the little brass contacts giving them less operating reliability since brass doesn't have much spring in the first place.
The originals are just crimped so I'll try that I've got the right crimper for these little pins so not expecting problems that you do get with cheap crimpers. I've even got a couple of original leads coming but the lead that I got first time around obviously has breaks in a couple of the wires rather than in the plug itself. It all makes life interesting once you get over the frustration when things don't work properly but I will learn to test leads before using them as I could have saved myself a lot of work in the first place.

[expresso]

I been buying those balance wires for years and never once received them with the board on one end as the picture shows not sure why they don't change the pic. I had to call to make sure I don't get the same as the picture with the board that I didn't want. Was told they don't have the board on the end as pictured . If u want that board I suggest u make sure to ask for it. It's just easier to use there ready made cable for balance wires

[Burgerman]

All mine have had that board. From singapore. Always in stock too.

[stevelawiw]

I might take a careful look at those and helicoil all of them.

That's what I'm going to do. I've been looking, but I'm finding it hard to find an M4 helicoil kit for blind holes. Does anybody have a link please?

[expresso]

From USA never had one with a board.

[Burgerman]

The ones with a board are for better strain relief. More reliable. Since they are only used in the battery area, and only get plugged in on installation rather than every charge, then either type are OK.

The end that plugs into the charger remains in the charger most of the time. And is the same on both types.

[Burgerman]

You can fit the helicoil upside down with the tang that you break off on the top. Loctite in place with never to be removed red...

That's what I'm going to do. I've been looking, but I'm finding it hard to find an M4 helicoil kit for blind holes. Does anybody have a link please?

[Burgerman]

https://www.screwfix.com/p/helicoil-eco ... eces/964fr

Or leave the tang in place.

If they are too long, use a dremmel to cut the extra bit off.

[expresso]

the supplier can attach the poles on top of the cells also would be 12mm exposed pole on top - making the Cell 215mm total - they use a lazer machine - thats another option also - not sure if its better to have them done or do your self - every setup can be different -

[stevelawiw]

Thanks. But don't I need something like the bottoming tap in the picture?
Also as the holes need squaring (you know what I mean) I was thinking I should use a milling cutter instead of a normal drill incase the drill just follows the hole?