Q LOGIC PROGRAMMING INTERFACE

[jptrx]

1314 - 4402 version 4.5.0
It's the latest Version by Curtis .... BUT they've updated the software that defines the allowed interface devices so that you must use A GENUINE CURTIS lead.

OK thanks Woody, now I have a question for you:

The new style Curtis/Pride hand held programmers (#1313-3309 dealer level), have the ability to save the .cpf file to an SD card so you can load it onto your computer, they also have a USB cable that allows you to load the .cpf file onto your computer. The programmer also allows you to reinstall the .cpf file back into your chairs power module. I know this because I've used a 1313-3309.

I am wondering if a person had the new version OEM 1314 PCPS software if they would be able to access and edit all the drive parameters not available with the "dealer" level programmer?

If this can be done, we would no longer need any kind of leed or dongle to edit our files. This is particularly attractive to me for 3 reasons.

1. I don't have a lap top computer.
2. I currently can't get the connection to work with my components.
3. The 1313-3309 costs less than the genuine curtis/pride lead dongle.

[jptrx]

I have the same bottom one and communicated with it.

Hi Seajays, just to be clear, you are saying you communicated with the "Q-Logic" joystick system not the "NE", correct?

[gologen]

The NE system looks exactly like the Curtis "enable 40".

"Enable 40" uses rs232 protocol not CAN-bus. See page 10 of "enable 40" manual. Try serial protocol.

5pin.jpg (62.95 KiB) Viewed 23930 times

[woodygb]

This is a way to get serial connection BUT you must use specific USB-Serial adaptor cables...the one in the pic is based on the CH340-341 Chip ..you may find the lead listed as HL340.
Another alternative is one made by Parralax.
http://www.parallax.com/product/28031

[jptrx]

The NE system looks exactly like the Curtis "enable 40".

"Enable 40" uses rs232 protocol not CAN-bus. See page 10 of "enable 40" manual. Try serial protocol.

5pin.jpg

Thanks so much Gologen!

I have looked at that page many times over the last few weeks, I just never new enough to see the difference between this and the CAN-bus.

I was about to make a trip to Guangzhou China to tell those boys what I thought of there A1+.

[jptrx]

This is a way to get serial connection BUT you must use specific USB-Serial adaptor cables...the one in the pic is based on the CH340-341 Chip ..you may find the lead listed as HL340.
Another alternative is one made by Parralax.
http://www.parallax.com/product/28031

Thanks to you as well Woody. I will try this and report back.

[D1vad]

The NE system looks exactly like the Curtis "enable 40".

"Enable 40" uses rs232 protocol not CAN-bus. See page 10 of "enable 40" manual. Try serial protocol.

Are you sure about that? I see nothing on page 10 that talks about a serial protocol. And there is this,

HANDHELD PROGRAMMER (1311)
The 1311 programmer is easy to use, with self-explanatory functions. After plugging in the programmer, wait a few seconds for it to boot up and gather information from the controller. For experimenting with settings, the program- mer can be left plugged in while the vehicle is driven.
The bookmark keys can make parameter adjustment more convenient. To set a bookmark, press one of the three bookmark keys for more than two seconds. To jump to a bookmarked location, press the appropriate bookmark key quickly (for less than two seconds).
The bookmark keys also have another function that makes program- ming easier. When setting the value of a parameter, you can use these keys to adjust the increments by which the value changes—with Bookmark Key 1, the value changes in 10-digit steps up or down; with Bookmark Key 2 pressed, the value changes in 100-digit steps; and with Bookmark Key 3, in 1000- digit steps—which, for most parameters, takes you from the maximum to the minimum, or vice versa.
PC PROGRAMMING STATION (1314)
The Programming Station is an MS-Windows 32-bit application that runs on a standard Windows PC. It can do everything the handheld programmer can do, and more. Its additional capabilities include saving/restoring sets of parameters to/from disk and updating software. Instructions for using the Programming Station are included with the software.
PROGRAMMER MENUS
There are six main menus, which in turn lead to nested submenus:
Program — provides access to the individual programmable parameters (see Section 5).
Monitor — presents real-time values during vehicle operation; these include all inputs and outputs, as well as the mapped throttle values and conditioned throttle requests (see Section 6).
Faults — presents diagnostic information (see Section 8), and also a means to clear the fault history file.
Functions — provides access to the parameter cloning/upload/download func- tions.
Information — displays data about the host controller: model and serial numbers, date of manufacture, and hardware and software revisions.
Programmer Setup — displays data about the programmer and provides LCD contrast control.

It specifically states that it uses the handheld programer!

[woodygb]

I see nothing on page 10 that talks about a serial protocol.

The picture states TX Data and RX Data

It specifically states that it uses the handheld programer!

... I'm afraid that I'm missing your point...

[woodygb]

Perhaps you have a misconception about the 1311 programmer ....isn't specifically for CAN it does Serial as well.

[D1vad]

Perhaps you have a misconception about the 1311 programmer ....isn't specifically for CAN it does Serial as well.

I see as I was not aware that it also does serial.

[woodygb]

N.P.

Here's the relevant blurb.

Model 1311 has several protocols to communicate with other
Curtis products. It automatically detects the correct protocol
and begins the data upload immediately upon power up. (It is
critical that the correct cable is used).

[D1vad]

OK thanks Woody, now I have a question for you:

The new style Curtis/Pride hand held programmers (#1313-3309 dealer level), have the ability to save the .cpf file to an SD card so you can load it onto your computer, they also have a USB cable that allows you to load the .cpf file onto your computer. The programmer also allows you to reinstall the .cpf file back into your chairs power module. I know this because I've used a 1313-3309.

I am wondering if a person had the new version OEM 1314 PCPS software if they would be able to access and edit all the drive parameters not available with the "dealer" level programmer?

If this can be done, we would no longer need any kind of leed or dongle to edit our files. This is particularly attractive to me for 3 reasons.

1. I don't have a lap top computer.
2. I currently can't get the connection to work with my components.
3. The 1313-3309 costs less than the genuine curtis/pride lead dongle.

I'd say it is unlikely,
http://curtisinstruments.com/?fuseactio ... evCPDF.pdf

States,

3.7 Cloning and restoring the previous programming
Cloning is the process of duplicating parameter settings from one unit to others, making copies or "clones". You may only clone units with the same hardware, software and parameter block. You cannot clone the MC-2 or products using the MCP protocol.
The special cloning functions are listed on the programmer in the Menu
'Functions -> Settings'.
From here, you can select
'Get Settings From Controller'
This will upload the data from a unit into the 1311. Or,
'Write Settings To Controller'
This will download the present data stored in the 1311 to the unit.
This process will only work between identical models. Model 1311 will not allow cloning between different models (1228 to 1243) nor between similar models (1244-4401 to 1244-4402). Only the data accessible by the 1311 is cloned. For example, a User level 1311 will only clone User level data and will not clone the OEM, Dealer or Service level data.
You may also easily restore the original settings of the unit . Each time the programmer is connected to a unit, it uploads the present data and stores it in a "temporary archive" memory. You can revert back to the original settings any time during a programming session by selecting the Menu
'Functions -> Settings -> Reset All Settings'.
Any inadvertent change of parameters can be 'undone' using this procedure - even if you can't remember what the previous settings were - as long as the programmer has not been un- plugged and power has not been removed from the controller.

[jptrx]

I'm not interested in cloning anything.

[falco peregrinus]

HOW TO BUILD A PLUG TO CONNECT TO THE CAN-BUS SOCKET OF A 5-PIN CURTIS/ QUANTUM CONTROLLER

Unfortunately the 5 pin socket (and matching plug) on the Curtis/ Quantum controller is apparently proprietary. Intensive searching on the internet did not found a plug that is clearly designed to suit the 5-pin socket on a Curtis/ Quantum controller. So I made one. This is how.

(1) Buy an 8 pin male and an 8 pin female in-line DIN plug and socket. They must be 8-pin - neither 5 nor 6-pin DIN plugs have any pairs of pins exactly 4mm apart.

(2) Dismantle both. These two photos show each of them dismantled. Keep each separate for the moment.

original male plug

02 male original.JPG (104.55 KiB) Viewed 21494 times

Original female socket

01 female original.JPG (105.29 KiB) Viewed 21494 times

(3) Identify two pins on the male plug that are exactly 4mm apart. Remove all the other pins except those two. (Push the pin through the plastic with a pair of pliers as far as it will go -by putting one half of the pliers on the pin and the other half on the plastic, and squeezing the pliers hard - then grab hold of the pin with the pliers and pull hard. Twisting at the same time may help. It won't be easy. Persevere.)

(4) Swap the metal shields between the two piles of bits.

(5) Put aside the bits that are now with the female socket, as shown in this photograph. You don't need them for this project.

We don't need these bits

03 discard these.JPG (87.24 KiB) Viewed 21494 times

For the remaining instructions, see my next post. Apparently I'm only allowed 3 attachments per post.
Falco

[falco peregrinus]

(6) These are the bits you need:

We want these

04 bits we want.JPG (95.31 KiB) Viewed 21492 times

(7) Test-assemble the plug, using just the bits shown in the previous photo, as shown in the next photo.

assemble like this

05 partly reassembled.JPG (94.36 KiB) Viewed 21492 times

(8) This is the finished result.

Finished result

06 fully reassembled.JPG (86.84 KiB) Viewed 21492 times

(9) Test insert it into the Quantum controller's TOP TWO SOCKETS (the two SMALL ones, not any of the three big ones.)

(10) Write "TOP" on the top of the inserted home-made plug using a permanent marker, so you never get confused about which way to insert the plug into the controller. (A genuine plug can only go in one way, but this home-made one is capable of going in two ways, so you need to mark which way you are always going to push it in, and wire it accordingly.)

(11) Solder wires to the two pins in the plug you just made, and connect the other end of the wires to the USB-CAN BUS adapter as per Woody's instructions in a previous post in this thread.

Falco

[falco peregrinus]

But before you race out and buy the bits I cited above, plus a USB-CAN BUS interface, so that you can interface your PC to your Curtis/ Quantum controller, get a quote for the genuine Curtis cable. I've got a quote for a genuine Curtis 5 pin cable that is cheaper than I can get a USB-CAN interface for, and I seem to recall Woody saying that the latest Curtis software must have the genuine cable, so I'm tempted to dump all plans to make my own cable and buy genuine!
Falco

[gologen]

Where did you find genuine Curtis cable and what is the price ?
I only was able to find original CAN/USB interface $798.75

cable.JPG (58.27 KiB) Viewed 21484 times

[falco peregrinus]

If you look closely at the web page you posted, you'll see that for $798.75 you also get the software. I went to the Curtis Industries website, found the product brochure that listed the part numbers for the various programming tools, and then went to their web page that listed their local agents, emailed their local agent quoting the part numbers of the products I was interested in, asked for price and availability, and got a quote back similar to yours for the software (OEM), and for the cable the quote was less than eBay price for the USB-CAN interface. (The 5 pin cable doesn't come with the software, according to the current Curtis Industries brochure.) I've always found the prices from local manufacturer's agents far more attractive than the prices dealers quote. Quite often a manufacturer's agent will quote you half the price of what a dealer will quote you. I suggest you email the Curtis agent in your country and see what price they can offer you.
And I must say the service was excellent! The answer came back very quickly, no hassles at all.
Falco.

[gologen]

If you look closely at the web page you posted, you'll see that for $798.75 you also get the software.

Yes. But separate cable much more - $838.69 and software - $64.68

[woodygb]

and for the cable the quote was less than eBay price for the USB-CAN interface.

..I suspect that is JUST a cable with a 5 pin plug ... without a Curtis CAN-BUS interface.

[falco peregrinus]

We'll know in a few days. I've now got one on order. Should arrive by the end of the week or early next week, I hope. Bit dearer than I thought - I forgot to take into account GST and freight - but it's still a bargain and less than half the price I paid for the genuine PGDT cable when I bought it. And even after GST and freight, it's still less than a CAN-BUS interface on eBay.com.au, but more than one on eBay.com. And if it is what I believe it is, then it avoids all the hassles that one could end up having before succeeding in getting a non-genuine solution to work. And seems how the latest version of the software requires a genuine cable, then I think it's worth a little extra to buy genuine over non-genuine, as insurance for the unknown future. Anyway, we'll know one way or the other by this time next week.
Falco.

[woodygb]

1314 download update.

http://www.fujifile.me/m3rsf60odvwc/1314.zip.html

[bluegizmo83]

Just an FWI.

I have a chair with an NE Series Joystick exactly as pictured here:


As someone has posted on here, these NE Series joysticks appear to be the same as the Curtis Enable 40 joysticks which use standard Serial communication. So I tried to connect to it using an Arduino UNO board as a USB-to-Serial converter which is easily doable, however, it would not communicate with the joystick. I kept getting a communication error. I do believe I had all the wires connected properly because when all the wires were not connected, or I had the wires backwards from what was correct, I would get a Timeout error in the software. So it appears using an Arduino UNO as a USB-to-Serial just doesn't work properly. I'm going to be buying the HL340 Usb-to-Serial cable that was recommended on here and see how that works.

The software I'm using is the 1314-4401 Version 3.12 (Build 35) Update Patch 6.

[woodygb]

There are only a few Serial interface solutions that work ... the actual logic signal appears to be inverted TTL.

Could you please update your profile with a location... it makes it easier to point you towards relevant ebay links etc.

[woodygb]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-to-RS232-Se ... 232f361799
http://www.ebay.com/itm/3Ft-USB-2-0-to- ... 3385d8e5c3

[bluegizmo83]

There are only a few Serial interface solutions that work ... the actual logic signal appears to be inverted TTL.

Could you please update your profile with a location... it makes it easier to point you towards relevant ebay links etc.

Thanks I added my location.

I kind of figured thats why my Arduino solution wasn't working, because the USB-to-Serial chip that is used on my two Arduino boards are the Atmega8U2 chip and FTDI chip... I'm still going to buy the recommended USB-to-Serial cable that was suggested on here, specifically this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-to-RS232-Se ... 232f361799

Also in the software I tried using both Enhanced Serial and just normal Serial, neither worked with my Arduino idea. But from what I gather, Enhanced Serial is what should work with the appropriate cable.

[woodygb]

I've always used serial when communicating with the various Curtis controllers that I have.

EDIT ... Whilst I remember ..and to save you some possible grief ..the COM Port number assigned by Windows MUST be 8 or under otherwise the software will not recognise it.

[bluegizmo83]

I've always used serial when communicating with the various Curtis controllers that I have.

Ok I'll try both when I get the right cable.

[falco peregrinus]

Further to my previous post: The cable (part number 36378005) has arrived from Curtis, and it does NOT have a USB plug on it. Here's a photo of what turned up:

Genuine Curtis 5 pin plug & cable

genuine 5 pin plug.JPG (105.62 KiB) Viewed 22981 times

Looking once more at the Curtis documentation that lists the part numbers, I now see something I missed earlier: namely, that included with the software is an item described as "USB interface", which does not have a separate part number listed in the Curtis document from which I got the part numbers for everything else (though no doubt one does exist, and it could be ordered, if you could find the part number somewhere and were prepared to pay the money asked.)

Now the really curious thing about this cable is that none of the pins on the 5 pin plug have a direct connection to any of the pins on the clear plastic plug! So maybe there is a CAN-BUS interface inside the plug case, or maybe there's an opto isolator in there - but there's something in there.

Anybody got any ideas about what the "USB interface" product item might be? And why there is no direct connection between the pins on the 5 pin plug and the clear plastic plug? Is this the reason why the latest Curtis software requires a genuine cable?

Anyway, whatever 36378005 is, it isn't what I need. So it's back to eBay, to find and order another USB-CAN-BUS interface. The last one I ordered took a month to get here, and when it arrived it wasn't what I had ordered (so Paypal gave me my money back). Try, try again.
Falco.

[gologen]

Anybody got any ideas about what the "USB interface" product item might be? And why there is no direct connection between the pins on the 5 pin plug and the clear plastic plug? Is this the reason why the latest Curtis software requires a genuine cable?

1309.jpg (91.06 KiB) Viewed 22979 times

From V4.2.0 (Build 301)

- Added: Maximum access level protection saved in 1309 USB interface

Maybe this prevents possibility to use non genuine devices.