New wheels for Permobil Street?

[kendradog]

What parts do I need to replace the wheel assemblies in a Permobil Street. Permobil no longer sells parts for new tires or wheels for this chair.

[Burgerman]

Tyres dont need to come from permobil. They can be made by many manufacturers across the world at much better prices. Same with many of the parts.
Are there some problem with the wheels? Or just the tyres?

Its possible to get rims (wheels) on eBay. Its also possible to fit alternative ones but that normally isnt plug and play. But I Have done that to all of my chairs for 25 years.

I can find you some tyres. On eBay, amazon etc.

Drive wheels/tyres or casters?

[swalker]

Are you asking just about the tires ore do you need the wheel and/or tires?

The wheels look like they are the same as used on the Permobil C350, C300, and C500 wheelchairs.

The last time I bought wheels for a C500, they were almost $1,000 (in the US). They are readily available on ebay for a reasonable price.

Tires are readily available for me (in the US) at somewhat reasonable costs. For the C350, C500, and F5 (which all use the same tires), I can buy standard foam-filled tires for about $200 per pair at www.buildmywheelchair.com.

Steve

[shirley_hkg]

Street's drive wheels are 3.50-8

[Burgerman]

They are. But are actually too wide for the rims. So the usual 3.00 x 8 are a better match. Same as every other chair uses.

[rlnguy]

PM sent

[rlnguy]

Assuming OP was talking about the rear wheels, I offer this information.
Street used the larger tire because it gave higher speed, Using the 3.00-8 would slow it down, and affect the seat and caster angle.
Most Street chairs sold in the US had “no flat” tires-(required by most funding agencies).
At that time, Permobil used a one piece tire rim/hub, so changing a flat free tire required a whole wheel and tire.
Permobil later changed to a 2 piece rim, and a separate hub, to attach it to the motor. It is possible to change to the newer design.
Changing tires is much easier with the split rim. There are a couple things to be aware of.
Originally, the hub for the motor shaft had 4 M8 threaded holes, to attach the wheelrim.
The later (and current version) only has 3 M8 bolts to attach the wheelrim. Also, the newer hub is “permanently” attached to the motor shaft with adhesive. I doubt you will find any of the 3 bolt hubs available.
If buying wheels and hubs from an online source, you want to make sure you get matching hubs and wheels.
I don’t know of any source for grey, non-marking tires, or for any flat free tire, in that size, but 3.50-8 tires are common on garden tractors and other outdoor power equipment.
You might be able to cut the old, worn out, tire off, with a sharp knife and install tires and tubes.
I’ve done it, but it wasn’t easy.

[Burgerman]

3.00 X 8 is 14 inch diameter.
3.50 x 8 is 15 diameter, a 7% increase according to my calculator..

So if a chair was 7mph on 3.00 x 8 tyres it will be almost 0.5mph faster with 3.50 x 8 tyres. Not sure if that tiny amount really matters or if you could tell, but it is slightly faster.

[kendradog]

Thanks very much for all the information provided.

I ended up using Grehua 3.50-8 air tires, https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09WQTR75V .

They work great outside, but unfortunately, at least on the first day, they have a detectable rubber odor that I notice if I'm indoors. This could be a problem going to restaurants, say. I wonder whether tires specifically made for wheelchairs are made from some odor-free material.

[Burgerman]

They are all odour free after a while.

[martin007]

Thanks very much for all the information provided.

I ended up using Grehua 3.50-8 air tires, https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09WQTR75V .

They work great outside, but unfortunately, at least on the first day, they have a detectable rubber odor that I notice if I'm indoors. This could be a problem going to restaurants, say. I wonder whether tires specifically made for wheelchairs are made from some odor-free material.

I wish you luck.
Those tires look really flimsy.


> https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/prod ... t_79880000

[kendradog]

They are all odour free after a while.

Do you know how long this takes?

[Burgerman]

Depends how new and how warm it is.

What happens is this. New tyre is made and contains all sorts of chemicals and oils and solvents. The newer they are the stronger they smell and the better they work. I used to race bikes. And always went around sniffing tyres! When in the shop. Because the strongest smelling ones were the grippyest and fastest and freshest. After a few weeks they were slower, harder and didnt really smell any more.

In a warm place in summer they smell very strongly. And not for long. Think "glue drying" still. The more these solvents and aromatics evaporate the faster they leave the tyre. And the warmer it is the stronger the smell and the faster this happens.

Of course different brands have different smells and some very little smell... But its hard to figure that out on eBay/amazon.

[kendradog]

But these tires are already typically sitting in a warehouse for 6 months or a year or longer. If the smell would dissipate, wouldn't it dissipate before they are sold?

Is the act of using the tires over and over that causes the odor to dissipate? If so, the amount of use my wheelchair tires is minimal compared to say an outdoor motorcycle.

But if it's "time since manufacture" that dissipates the odor, then the odor would have most likely dissipated long before the tires were shipped to the end user.

I cannot believe it's such a hassle just to get 3.50-8 tires for an old Street, pneumatic or otherwise. People make 3.0-8 tires; they make 4.10-8 tires, why don't they make 3.50-8 tires? I literally might have to buy a whole new wheelchair over this issue.

[Burgerman]

They do make 3.50 - 8 tyres. Huge choice. Also metric equivelent sizes. And other sizes can also be fitted. Tyres are like a new car. Or a freshly painted room. It takes a while before all the oils and glues or paints fully cure. The fact that they are giving off a smell shows that this evaporation/curing is still taking place. So obviously it will go away. I honestly fitted dozens of different tyres to wheelchairs of at least 15 different sizes. Personally I dont even notice this rubber smell. At least unless you pointed it out. Probably because I go through a lot of yres. I buy them 8 at a time normally so they spend time in the garage. But old tyres dont smell. As to how long its been in some warehouse, who knows. Try a different brand and they may be less rubbery.

Also, while that may be the size that permobil fitted, it is actually too wide for the rim. And deforms the tyre. The 3.00 - 8 tyre is the correct width for that wheel rim. So you could easily fit that too.

[kendradog]

Well, I guess I'll give it some time then. None of the wheelchair tires I have ever purchased over the last 23 years has ever smelled at all, but the first non-wheelchair tire I purchased for my wheelchair has an overpowering smell. This leads me to the conclusion that non-wheelchair tires may not be designed for using/storing wheelchairs indoors in a small space. Obviously if one keeps one's wheelchairs in a garage or a large house, it's probably fine.

Also, my understanding--web sources are heavily inconsistent and wildly confusing as to the meaning of tire measurements, so who knows?--is that the 3.50 in 3.50-8 refers to some kind of diameter and not to width. A 3.00-8 tire would tilt the chair backwards because the diameter is smaller, and a 4.00-8 tire tilts the chair forward a bit. Certainly the original Permobil Street tires are sold as 3.50-8.

[Burgerman]

a 350 x 8 tyre is 3.5 inches wide (and tall on the sidewall) and fits an 8 inch diameter rim. It also needs a rim that is about 3 inches wide. The ones on your chair are 2. Designed for a tyre that is 3.00 x 8. So when a 3.5 wide tyre is fitted it pinches the beads inwards and makes the tyre look a little odd and wear out the tread centre faster.

If you fitted a 3.00 x 8 tyre then it will be 1 inch overall smaller. The chair will then ride exactly half an inch lower at the rear. Which will hardly be noticed. I have in the past used 3.50 and 3.00 section tyres on the same chair no problem. But these things are up to you! The angle that changes with such a small difference in diameter will likely never be a problem. Some tyres have little smell even when new. But buying online doesent allow you to check this. I suggest buying a few spare sets of tyres and leaving them somewhere to "cure" over time so that it doesent bother you in the future when needed. Or calling a bricks and mortar store and getting them to smell the 3.50 tyres for you and see which ones they have that dont smell strong.

Incidentally, I have 5 chairs. 3 in my kitchen, 2 in my bedroom. All using non standard sized black tyres. No smell whatsoever. But they have been here for between 3 and 23 years! In various states of rebuild/new tyres during that time. Theres even at least 20 extra tyres stacked under my bench in my bedroom. No smell. Just give it a little time!

[martin007]

This leads me to the conclusion that non-wheelchair tires may not be designed for using/storing wheelchairs indoors in a small space.

I'm going to give you some advice about it.
The front wheels (split rim) of my power chair use 200 x 50 tyres.
I have three options.

1-
If you buy a mobility tyre you will get a grey tyre.
The tyre is very expensive, flimsy and not durable.

2-
You can buy a standard black tyre.
The scooters use these tyres.
The tyre is cheap, flimsy and not durable.

3-
I buy industrial tyres.
They are black, cheap, resistant and durable.

[ex-Gooserider]

Worth noting that the tires in the warehouse were probably wrapped in plastic or similar material to keep them from aging, which also keeps the smell in... Even without the wrap, they probably had little air circulation and were in a stack of other tires that would keep the smell from dissipating as quickly... See what happens if you run them for a while. It may also help to scrub them down w/ the same sorts of stuff you'd use to wash your car, or even spray household cleaner... Some of the stink may be coming from manufacturing 'mold release' or preservative coatings that are just on the surface of the tire, (some places also apply a blacking dressing to the tires to make them look nice) and cleaning them off might help...

I know that back in my 'motorcycle shop rat' days, we always cautioned folks getting new tires to be cautious about exploring the 'outer limits' of traction until they had gotten a few miles on them in order to give the 'new-tire dressing' a chance to wear off...

ex-Gooserider

[Burgerman]

I used to like new slippy tyres, great fun hitting them with a few hundred HP coming out of turns as they drift and smoke up. That lasts about one and a half corners till they warm up then they stick like shit to a blanket.