Amy idea...

[Burgerman]

http://amysystems.com/AmyPower/Brochures/Alltrack_Series_Product_Brochure.pdf

The REAR drive one of these (dunno what its called or why this brochure doesent show it?) already comes with the 8.5mph groove motors option. Or rather AMT... This may be a good rear drive chair candidate for the US? Or is it really a groove by a different name? Same motors, Rnet 120 etc.

Either way it could swap out the batteries for my lithium pack at 45v and roboteq controller and presto! A ready to go REAR drive chair with 15 mph and 45 plus miles of range!

Just an idea...

[Step]

Have you seen the rear casters on that thing?
If you're changing the controller, the Pride thing that popped up in another thread the other day might be an option as well...

[Burgerman]

No. BUT I have a saw!

Pride stuff tends not to do much for me. But will take a look when it appears. I suspect it will be long, heavy, limited ground clearance. Of course many need that for stability outdoors though. But being pride it will not have 8.5mph motors, so 15 mph with 45v and a roboteq 50v controller wont be possible either?

[LROBBINS]

The Amy RWD is actually LONGER than the MWD, and without footplates is LONGER than the BM2. On the other hand, the MWD although longer than the BM2 (which with its aft CG is an "almost" MWD) is smaller than many MWD, and may be a decent choice if one needs tilt & lift. Haven't seen one up close and personal though.
Ciao,
Lenny

[Step]

I think Pride offers 8.5mph motors as an option on most, if not all chairs though...
It just might cost you a kidney.

I'm not defending Pride chairs, I just think the setup was better then the half-MWD setup that Amy tries to sell as a RWD.
I think cutting off the rear casters would make it flip over whenever you touch the 150 amp controller feeding the motors 48 volts.

[Burgerman]

wELL THATS EXACTLY WHAT THE bm3 WILL DO!

[Step]

FYI, that sneak preview of that Pride chair was a US preview.
It's already being sold on the old continent as the Quantum Lightning
specs for the base model here: http://www.pride-mobility.co.uk/product.aspx?id=95&range=2#
group 24 batteries are ok-ish...
R-net controller is an option apparently... I assume it'll be much like Handicare's policy... base model gets 90A VR-2 and 4mph motors
upgrade to 6 or 8.5mph motors gets the 120 amp R-net.
That's what I got.

it is pretty much as I thought.
driving base is a battery box with a suspension system where the motors and front casters attach to.
Seating is bolted on, much like the F55, with 2 brackets, allowing you to play with position when you make your own brackets.

They can probably add a tilt/recline/lift unit as well.

I'd like to see the back though.
My handicare Alex doesn't allow a narrower battery box with the batteries mounted length-wise because of the rear suspension arm support things.
If pride manages it without those, I think this could be quite an interresting chair base.
Narrow BM3 battery box with 48v lithiums, roboteq controller and the suspension system mounted to the battery box, 8.5mph motors with fat tires and a seat like the F55 on top.

[LROBBINS]

The Lightning is 35" long WITHOUT foot riggings!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Within a fraction of an inch of the AMY chairs.
Ciao,
Lenny

[Step]

yeah and that's excellent.

Shorten the anti-tip bars and use the tiny skateboard wheels,
move C of G rearward by using the seat system adjustability and maybe different fixing plates,
replace the grey rehab tires with black ones and tubeless wheels at the rear,
move armrests inwards, maybe use smaller pads,
put a central BM style footplate between the front wheels and you're not too far off 40" length and under 25" width.

Of course you don't have the float of the wide tires

My point is that with this base, you do have some possibilities of making it a lot better.
That's what I did with the Alex.
I got it for free thanks to healthcare here so I got good 4-pole motors, a good 120Amp controller, suspension, a base frame, seating, ...
Stuff I wouldn't have if I had to buy it from my own pocket.
And I worked with that, based on BM and all your ideas to make my own blend, that works for me.

Even if the f55 base is the best base to start from, there are other starting points as well
I think that was the idea BM launched at the top.

[Swan T.W.]

Same footprint as the Permobil 350. That makes it at least 3" to long.

[LROBBINS]

Someone just posted a video of the Amy on WCJ. It's rough terrain behavior looks pretty impressive.+
Ciao,
Lenny

[bjack56]

Amysystems JUST finished a re-design of their RWD chair. After 9 months of waiting for a test drive, the rep. finally got the first from R&D so I took it for a spin last week It is not a "true" Rear Wheel Drive, but a hybrid (cross between mid & rear wheel drive). Their website is VERY weak, but IMHO looks like Amy is concentrating on engineering. I tried their mid-wheel last June, so need to try it again for comparison while RWD impressions are fresh in mind. You can take a look at their mid-wheel over inclines, obstacles, grassy slopes, snow, etc...here: http://amysystems.com/AmyPower/main.html

I'm a C5-6 quad for 30+ years, so will give some highlights since 2-finger typing any longer a post is a PITA. Will try to answer any questions you may have, if I can. Started research for a new power chair over a year ago. Time to retire my 7+ year old Pride/Quantum Blast & check out all the new chair & seating options to meet MY needs/wants. I also have a Quickie2 manual chair which I use around the house from time to time, exercise & when going to places like a friend's house that's not accessible for entry. I have family spread all over the country, so something for flying & all the stuff (plane transport, transportation, etc..) was a big consideration.

The following might not be totally accurate, but the best opinion/info. I can do based on research & a couple of hours with the chair. Amysystems has been making some of the most versatile & lowest height (floor to seat pan) tilt-recline-elevate seating systems for most any mfg's. power base for quite a while. A few years ago they decided to mfg. their own power chairs & opened a facility in Champlain, NY, USA. I'm not sure if they are sharing license/patent or making chairs for Quickie Canada (http://www.quickiexpower.com/), but they appear to be almost identical. Many parts seem to be the same, so if you're trying to decide on customization, apparently LOTS of parts or options found on Sunrise Med. (Quickie USA) or Quickie Canada will work on Amy chairs. I think Amysystems has made some serious improvements to the power base though.

Test chairs:
RWD: power tilt-recline, power center footplate, swing-away legrest, high back, adj. headrest, PG R-net control (new version), solid insert tires
MWD: power elevate-recline, power center footplate, PG R-net control, solid insert tires (referenced here but no full review)
BOTH: all parts & frame are aircraft aluminum. Lighter weight & VERY durable!! I've yet to break my older than dirt Quickie P-100 & V-521 of same material.
***I currently use 3" Otto Bock Cloud cushion, fixed canes & Jay Back which are about 18" above the seat pan, so the top-of-shoulder backs were very awkward for me.

PROS (RWD):
1) Ride is awesome...very smooth & easy on the lower back. All 6 wheels & motor are independent suspension. Took rough lawn & large bumps in driveway/road at faster speed nicely! I think the MWD might(?) be a little smoother, but need to test again..
2) Drive motors run extremely quiet & an almost inaudible "clunk" on start/stop. Had to try to hear it.
3) Same for their newly re-designed power seating motors. Had to strain to hear tilt, recline or power footplate.
4) New! All pivot points/connections on suspension (#1 above) have aircraft bushings to eliminate wear & squeaks over time. Some "special" material (can't remember), not standard nylon.
5) Same bushings (above) in their sleek drop-in, swing-away legrest/hangars.
6) 3 motor options w/ biggest set to 8.5 mph. Supposed to be capable of faster? MWD is limited to about 6 mph max. option.
7) Turning very close to MWD, but a little larger radius.
8) Adj. height joystick option. One of my must haves.
9) Joystick has a 6" lead to another plug, so can quick release to carry onto the plane to prevent damage.
10) Programmer is about 6"(l)x2"(w)x3/4"(thk) box. Plug between #8 connection (above) & custom program through R-net LCD screen. Also, has USB connection for firmware updates or trouble shooting with Amysystems tech support over internet.
11) Battery box opens from rear latch. Has pull-out tray & quick-connect plug. A must if you fly anywhere!
12) Center mount footplate does not interfere with front casters regardless of height!
13) More for the asking

CONS:
1) Those big a$$ rear caster forks. Not a true RWD, so it is needed for this hybrid.
Solution: I think I can replace with different fork (ie: froglegs) or force a solid rubber front caster insert on it horizontally to make a bumper. Need to prevent,tearing-up walls & kitchen base cabinets after the martini so wife doesn't take away my driving privileges in a brand new chair.
2) No "stock" fold forward cane back like Pride has. Plane cargo doors are 34" high opening, so they will remove batteries, lay on it's side & cram stuff in which has led to broken parts.
Solution: There is a fixed, adjustable angle cane back option. Add some quick-release pins & fold. Or, install Pride's cushion in place fold forward hardware.

Arm's getting tired...so about it for the Amy. Still checking things out, but all-in-all the PRO's are winning over Otto Bock B600, Permobile Street

Don't want to get started on a BRAND NEW option out soon for me & lower SCI's. This look's WAAAAAAAAAY cool for travel: http://beachmobility.com/ZX1/video.html

Hope this helps.

[Burgerman]

My own BM2 and BM3 chairs are also a sort of reardrive but very tippy setup. Much like the cross between the chair you tested and a rear drive.

It of course doesent have the rear casters... Get it wrong and it tips you out of the rear. But it turns as you americans put it on a dime. And has no crap sticking out the rear. And can wheelie over objects and for fun at any speed. Much like a sport manual chair.

So was thinking, move seaat forwards an inch and just chop them off the Amy rwd chair. That will make it short like mine, and still very capable outdoors.

[LROBBINS]

I suspect that one of the reasons that Amy has those big rear casters on the chair is that they started out manufacturing tilt/lift/recline systems. The stability problems really do get very hard to deal with if the CG goes back or up. Ciao, Lenny

[Burgerman]

Mobile phone is my stability system. Its only been needed about 6 times since 97. I fall over the back, and dial a friend...

[bjack56]

Have you looked at any of the videos linked above? Mid-wheel drive's have similar caster setup.

[Burgerman]

Yes.

I like short. And they stick out. And wheelies are essential. And the control, and ability to get into and out of tight spaces it gives me. If I had the amy systems chair, I would feel restricted by the rear casters as they would be in my way 1000 times a day and simply cut them off.

They stop me poping wheelies to get up over an obstacle. And the world is full of obstacles! The downside is that its possible to tip yourself out now and again if you get it badly wrong. But it doesent hurt.

This will go places the amy chair cant. http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/ultimat ... rchair.htm

I do think its a candidate for simple mods such as the lithium packs as in my BM3 powerchair though.

You could post a review here:

[2senile]

The REAR drive one of these (dunno what its called or why this brochure doesent show it?)

They must have updated their brochue since you first posted; it's on the right-hand side on page one & bottom left page three.. It looks good at first glance ... but then I noticed the anti-tip. My guess is it is one of those that "always" have conntact with the ground with something like 3 degree movement. Can't see it well enough to judge if BM would need his hacksaw or just a screwdriver & spanner to "correct" it.
It comes with 8" front casters with option of 9". Shouldn' cause any problem fitting 10"??

[Burgerman]

Well maybe. The 10 inch ones are actually 9.5. But its the width. They are 3 inches wide.

[bjack56]

Burgerman,

I DO like your modded chair! Do you sell them?

Curious what you thought of the new ZX1 Manual Chair Power Add-on in my earlier post? http://beachmobility.com/ZX1/
A company called Spinergy bought the license from the "beachmobility" guy & it's supposed to be ready for mass market any day now.