PINNED - Where to find everything powerchair related

[SteveO]

Just been looking at the Roboteq Controllers and seen them here http://www.robotshop.com/uk/roboteq-vdc-smartamps-10v-50v-robot-controller.html priced at £403. Is this a good price and can we get VAT free in the uk?

[Burgerman]

http://www.roboteq.com/index.php/robote ... 450-detail

HDC2450 is the one I am using. I ordered from the US and didnt pay vat after a fight and 20 calls...

You need to understand this. http://www.robotshop.com/media/files/pd ... dc2450.pdf all but the scripting and brushless bits. Although you will be loading scripts written by lenny and adjusting parameters in the user section here:

Script
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... Script.txt

Not trying to scare you but make you understand whats involved. If you can follow most of that then you should be ok. You will need to make own complex proffesional loom, use own mosfet and power breakers controlled by roboteq via SSDs as well as inverter and ssd for brakes etc. Gets very complex, make own joystick, calibrate and set everything up correctly and safely. Its not trivial. But its not that hard as long as you can think and read!

[SteveO]

http://www.roboteq.com/index.php/roboteq-products-and-services/brushed-dc-motor-controllers/hdc2450-detail

HDC2450 is the one I am using. I ordered from the US and didnt pay vat after a fight and 20 calls...
I
You need to understand this. http://www.robotshop.com/media/files/pd ... dc2450.pdf all but the scripting and brushless bits. Although you will be loading scripts written by lenny and adjusting parameters in the user section here:

Script
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... Script.txt

Not trying to scare you but make you understand whats involved. If you can follow most of that then you should be ok. You will need to make own complex proffesional loom, use own mosfet and power breakers controlled by roboteq via SSDs as well as inverter and ssd for brakes etc. Gets very complex, make own joystick, calibrate and set everything up correctly and safely. Its not trivial. But its not that hard as long as you can think and read!

Yes, I understand what you're saying and I'm getting as much info as I can to make an informed decision as to what I can or can't do. Right now, I think. It's too much for me just yet but I've been reading the manual tonight and will carry on tomorrow. I appreciate your honest, tell it as it is, opinion. If I think it's beyond I'll still go ahead with my BM2 direction and save the Roboteq/Lithium version perhaps as new info makes things a little easier. Making a new battery box, wheels, tyres, better batteries, 100a power module, much better cables, charger and terminals/connectors and programming will all make for an easier life but I'm still going to read on before I decide which way to go. So I sincerely thank you for giving me your advise, you're doing a fantastic thing here. Probably much more than you think.

[Burgerman]

Lithium is simple enough. Don't even consider lead. its not the 1900s any longer.

[SteveO]

Lithium is simple enough. Don't even consider lead. its not the 1900s any longer.

I thought the Lithium option was just for the larger voltage and therefore needed the Roboteq controller but now I've read more, I can keep to 24v and still use the P&G controller for now so I'll be planning around the Lithium and do my sums. Lithiums longevity makes sense of course but as the saying goes "money talks" Trouble is, there's so much stuff that can be done to make a chair better than standard, it makes deciding which way to go so much harder.

[steves1977uk]

I'm using Lithium with a Pilot+ controller for over 16 months without any issues.

Steve

[Burgerman]

12V -- Roboteq only can use 12V - dont bother its inneficient and slow. But can be done.

24V -- Roboteq and ALL mobility controllers can be used on 24V and lead or LiFePO4 safely. Small speed boost on roboteq. Very small speed increase on LiFePO4 too, and huge range increases IF DONE PROPERLY. On lead this is about as far as you can sensibly go. Roboteq offer's considerably better torque and power. With less heating. Worth doing for sport. Otherwise no point.

36V -- Roboteq only, offers increase in speed by 55 percent over 24v lead. With zero loss of range and increased torque over lead. So greater efficiency.

45 / 48V -- Roboteq only, offers same range as 24v options, increased torque, and double the speed... Huge efficiency gain. ). Or use lower geared motors, for less speed but still faster than 24V, increased torque and massive range because of low gearing/Amps. Only LiFePO4 will work.

[flagman1776]

Voltage is voltage. It does not matter to the controler the source of the voltage so long as it is correct (there is typically a bit of tollerance for exact voltage). I am running "24"volt LiFePO4 on a TravelScoot which is not a factory option. Burgerman's accessment is quite correct & is based on ways to obtain the needed voltage for the different controlers.
Any normal 24 volt controler will work fine on "24" LiFePO4 except the charge indicators won't work because the are based on the falling voltages of the OEM lead bricks.
The challenge of a LiFePO4 conversion is to layout the cells within the space designed for the lead batteries.

[gordo]

Recently purchased a quickie rumba (with a CTE 4C24080A 24v charger) for my wife. We chose it because we can fold it up and put it in our car. I want to purchase (or construct) an off-board charging loom to connect the batteries directly to the charger so we can leave the chair in the car and bring just the batteries into the house to charge overnight. I need to know how to wire the cable and a source for the connectors. Contacted Sunrise but they claim they can't help. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

[Burgerman]

Do you bring these in one at a time?

And seperate connections that you can see?

Best bet is to charge them with a 12V charger in series as its healthier for the batteries. Something like a Ctek 7A one would do it if you are not in a hurry. But your 24V charger will be fine as well as long as you know whet to connect to where?

[Burgerman]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-PIN-XLR-SOC ... 1598826584

You need one of those, above.

And an anderson connector that is the same colour as the sunrise one to connect to the existing battery loom. If that comes into the ghouse with the batteries. Probably red.

If that loom doesent, then you can just use 4 jump lead type crocodile clips. And a short bit of cable similar to what is on the charger already.

[Mark]

Do you bring these in one at a time?

And seperate connections that you can see?

Best bet is to charge them with a 12V charger in series as its healthier for the batteries.

Parallel surely on 12V

[Burgerman]

Other than he wants to use the existing charger. And its 24v so needs series conection. May as well use the battery loom as they unplug from the chair.

[gordo]

They come in together. Two 12V batteries connected in series. Connector is black.

[Burgerman]

That doesent make it simple. But you will likely need to take off the lids, fit a charge connector on each battery. Then leave it somewhere that you can get at its connector more easily. Its quite simple to get 2 blade terminals that fit that connector. But its also easy to connect it in reverse if you are not careful.

Do you understand what it meands to charge in series or parallel?
Can you make up a couple of cables? With ring terminals that fit the battery and a connector to plug into a charger cable?

[steves1977uk]

BM, aren't the batteries join in series via the grey anderson? If so, then why don't gordo buy a dual bank 12v charger, fit 2 andersons to that and when he wants to charge them, just pull the andersons apart on the battery and plug in the charger with the 2 andersons.

Steve

[Burgerman]

That will connect only one battery. He wants to use the charger he has. And any cheap 12V charger would charge in parallel if that anderson link was undone...

[LROBBINS]

Don't those connectors have some kind of interlock, or have the two spades at right angles? If so, he can make his own polarized connector with two spade terminals and some epoxy even if he can't find a matching connector.

[Burgerman]

He sounds like he is after a ready to go solution though. If so it might be better to visit an auto electrician with 2 batteries and a charger.

[SteveO]

image.jpeg (16.11 KiB) Viewed 45778 times

Had to post this as I couldn't believe my luck. I'm wanting to get on with my build but the lithium batteries are so expensive I've decided to get a set of odyssey batteries for now and then by the time the batteries need changing I'll have the lithium all set up and ready to go. Anyway that's the side story, this is my reason for posting. I've just received, all shiny and brand new 2 x Odyssey PC1500DT batteries for the price of £374.23 all inclusive with free delivery. Anyway I'm gonna start working out the parts etc that I need this weekend and see if I can get this done before the summer arrives.

[Burgerman]

Where?

[SteveO]

Where?

Just noticed you can't see the invoice very well. It was from a company in Abingdon called Frogsisland4x4

[Burgerman]

http://www.frogsisland4x4.com/wheels_an ... ryPC1500dt

[SteveO]

http://www.frogsisland4x4.com/wheels_and_spacers/batteries_odyssey/odyssey_batteryPC1500dt

That's just weird?????

[Andrey]

Sorry if it's offtop here, but I have to ask some tough questions for me.

I'm planning to build BM2/BM2v2 clone in nearest future and slowly piece by piece looking for parts (lack of money, long project, etc..).

As I already have programming cable for VR2 my choice should be VR2 90A or Pilot+ 100A (Pilot+ is better because of more amps, right? Does programming cable (PC) from VR2 compatible?).

There is plenty of used Pilot+ 100A on ebay, but...

1. Is it ok to buy such used Pilot+ controllers from ebay?
2. Almost all these controllers have no any cables (from controller to motors and batteries). Where I should get cables? Buy new from dealers or make by myself, are they still available?
3. Where to get lighting module for Pilot+? Dealers? (I have no local dealers, so only this available to me: http://parts.sunrisemedical.eu/template/index.php)
4. Though there is plenty of Pilot+ controllers, there a very few Pilot+ joysticks. Where to get them also?

Yeah, I suppose best way and cheapest way is to buy used F55 with Pilot+100A, lighting and 4-pole motors in good condition and cheap but it is almost impossible.

I have talked to Sunrise Medical dealer about buying F55 frame, forks and so on, and they told me that F55 is discontinued and quote: "Unfortunately we don’t supply those parts anymore.".

So my current strategy is:

buy used F55, preferable cheap (because of frame, maybe forks, seat frame, lights etc);
buy used controller and joystick (pilot+);
buy new motors - 4pole, 10/13kph (groove I suppose?);
build lithium pack with headways (24V);
buy all other stuff that are not related to powerchair manufacturers;
do custom work.

Any advices? Where am I wrong? What's the best way to do that from scratch with limited budget?

Thank you a lot.

This board has priceless information! Some topics I read more than few times. Thank you guys for sharing.

[Burgerman]

Basically all you said. Exept that groove motors really require 120A Rnet controller.

[Andrey]

Basically all you said. Exept that groove motors really require 120A Rnet controller.

Thank you, it's a valuable remark. 120A Rnet is good, but... programming tools pretty expensive as I understand.

What kind of available motors are perfect fit for BM2v2 (green one) like powerchair with pilot+ and lithium by your opinion?

[Burgerman]

Any 4 pole 6mph ones...

[saker98]

I hope this is going where it should?

I have just purchased Sterling Power PSP12202 Battery Charger for my small chair Cheap Kymco while I am trying to convert an old Mk1 F55s.

https://www.eurobatt.co.uk/sterling-pro-sport-waterproof-battery-charger-12-24v-20a-2-out-psp12202

The company will also refund your V.A.T via you completing the relative form, for now, as they are changing their website to have this incorporated into the purchase process very shortly.

They provided an excellent no quibble service.

They also do competitive prices on all their batteries.

[Burgerman]

You realise thats 10A + 10A at 24V? It wont charge your chair at 20A.