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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Fedor » 20 Sep 2017, 15:49

Thanks for the detailed answer. Rarely where you can find such compact and accurate information. Thank you.

About charge voltage and commercial Gel chargers. It's ridiculously comical, but when I contacted a developer of one of these and asked what profile they use and what they recommend voltage for the MK batteries. I told them about the recommended voltage not more than 14.1v and gave them a link to MK2.pdf.

They contacted the engineer from MK Powered and he said that 14.4v (28.8v) the best for such batteries. And 28.2v is not a fully charged battery. So, MK Powered has an extensive documentation with a lot of examples, but their engineers do not follow it.

It's like a conspiracy.

On the one hand, we can blame the developers of chargers. On the other hand, they follow the advice of battery developers.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 20 Sep 2017, 16:54

It depends on if you speak to all those employees that have been told that 14.4 is "ok", or some dummy that has just read the latest mobility sell sheet as this is the new marketing line. Or if you go by the once freely available mass of MK technical documents. Two years ago, they all quietly disappeared from MKs web sites. To be replaced by, nothing! Ignorance allows them to sell more batteries!
There is now no tech sheets available at all. Just glossy (newer) dumbed down sell sheets remain, with a now wider voltage limit allowed. Non of the original ones that mention 14.1v max or show the affect on cycle life etc, or warranty void etc remain. We know the truth. Its why I keep hold of the tech sheets here. The reason they do it, is it allows them to sell batteries that conform to the "standard" 14.4V IUoU EU charger profile. A universal standard that is safe for all lead based batteries. But safe is a different thing to optimal. Sonnenschein did something very similar, but instead of smooth natural voltage/temp curves as expected on the graphs, they just DREW some straight lines that happen to comply!

Theres another problem with charging at 14.4v. And I can show you it happen easily. With MK and Sonnenschein gel. And that is that if you have an older battery, or a newer one on a warm day, it will never drop down to the low current point where the charger is looking to terminate. Because the gassing 14.4V causes, makes heat. Which warms the battery. (which is why you need to watch it, or set a safe 8 hour time limit to try and catch it. And instead of current falling it starts to climb again. Current rises. Which warms the battery. Which causes current to rise more. Rinse and repeat. You end up with a bad smelling melted battery - its called thermal runaway.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Fedor » 11 Oct 2017, 04:05

Thanks again.

I have another small question about the GEL. Do all models and manufacturers have the same discharge curve or can it change? At me on absolutely new MK Powered (i previously used a different brand) the display of a charge on a wheelchair concerning a distance of travel has changed, and for the worse.

I now test and investigate possible causes (measuring the voltage in different stages), but can this be the error indicator of the discharge on the wheelchair? If, of course, the discharge curve could change...
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 04:29

Different battery TYPES such as Gel, are all basically the same. Although different to AGM, or wet, or pure lead like odyssey/optima etc. But all are pretty close.

But heres the thing. The battery gauge is worse than useless. It works on voltage, averaged over time.

If I take a brand new MK battery, and drive a chair for 5 mins hard, say up a steep hill, it may use only 2 or 3Ah, and yet its voltage will fall a long way. A battery meter will then read a lot lower than its true state of charge for 12 to 24 hours.

Likewise, if I drive along a flat road at constant speed at say 3mph, current draw is low, but intime I once again I have taken the SAME 3Ah out of the battery more slowly, the battery gauge will now still read full. Because the voltage will not have dropped much.

Now some batteries do this more than others. The lower the peukert value, and the lower the internal resistance the less the voltage drops under a heavy load, and the sooner it recovers. And to complicate things further, a battery resistance, and peukert values go up as you discharge it. Som, likethe MK, do this a LOT on purpose. It means that they get a better cyce life due to the battery running out of electrolyte before the plates become fully sulfated as you discharge. In other words they use whats called starved electrolyte. As they become discharged, the sulfuric acid becomes weaker. It turns into lead sulfate and lead dioxide and coats the plates. Eventually the battery electrolyte is basically just water which doesent conduct. So as you try to drive the voltage colapses. And protects the plates. Other batteries such as the Odyssey ones, are not starved, so you can discharge them much deeper at high loads with less voltage collapse, and faster recovery.

What does all this tell us? Stick some tape over the battery gauge and ignore it. Its only there to make you feel good. It cant ever know the state of charge. And neither can you with a volt meter.

Theres 3 ways to know the state of charge of a sealed lead battery. And ONLY three.
1.Fully charge it, at the correct voltage, till its dropped below 1000th of capacity in Amps. So 70mA for a 70Ah battery. Then its 100 percent!

2. Fully discharge it to around 10.8V over 24 hours or longer at low current and then its at 0% charge.

3. DISCONNECT it completely from the powerchair. Wait 24 hours. Not sooner. Then measure voltage with a recently calibrated quality voltmeter. Then look at the temperature of the battery. Then compare this to the state of charge/temperature graph from the specific battery manufacturer.

Thats the only way. Everything else is a bad guess.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Fedor » 11 Oct 2017, 17:29

I understand that it is more correct to look at the actual voltage of the battery with a considerable pause after the load current or charging.

I just was confused that if the discharge curve is the same, then why did the behavior of the battery gauge change?
But logically, I understand that this can have many reasons. And yet not the fact that the problem is in the battery itself.

Now my indicator shows 5 units (total 7). And the batteries show 12.75v on both after pause.
I found updated technical documentation for the MK Gel batteries here: http://www.mkbattery.com/pdf/mktechm.pdf

It is curious, but in comparison with the old documentation (MK2.pdf on this site) there the data on the discharge voltage changed. This is the latest documentation and I have no idea why it has changed:

Image

Well, if I take this data, then 12.75v is something like 87% of the charge and battery gauge on the wheelchair is exactly lying. But I will continue to measure the battery gauge and the real voltage after a pause. I want to understand exactly how the battery behaves. At the same time, I do not want to very deeply discharge and shorten the life of the battery. So this is important information i think.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 17:47

Well, if I take this data, then 12.75v is something like 87% of the charge and battery gauge on the wheelchair is exactly lying.
They ALL lie!
But I will continue to measure the battery gauge and the real voltage after a pause.

Your pause better include a day, and the battery discharge history in Amps over time, battery temp, battery age and cycle life, and remaining capacity too, or no amount of examination can tell you anything useful!
I want to understand exactly how the battery behaves. At the same time, I do not want to very deeply discharge and shorten the life of the battery. So this is important information i think.

To determine state of charge, on a new HEALTHY battery with full Ah capacity available, which is only the first few months of use, you need a Turnigy Watt Meter. It counts Ah out. Or in on charge. And its cheap.Voltage wont help you.
However that too is problematic. Because at what point do you decide a 73Ah is say 80% discharged? You cant ever reach that point on a lead battery./ powerchair because it stops moving after around 50Ah at best! So a batteryu meter showing a true 20 percent remaining will allow you to break down at about the 66% point!

No its a waste of time. I can charge 2 batteries to 100 percent. I can then take 10Ah from each one. In a different way.
Lets say I take .5A for 20 hours from one.
And I take 500A from the other say cranking my van for 50 secs.

BOTH batteries are now at the exact same state of charge.
Batt A is still sitting at 12.85 approx, and will climb very slightly by .1 of a volt over the next 24 hours.
Batt B is now down to well below 10V and its voltage initially climbs fairly fast, and you will be able to watch it do this right up to ALMOST the same 12.85V eventually. But it will take at least 24 hours.

And the actual level it drops to has many variables... Even temperature, acid starting strength, acid volume, and battery peukert value and internal resistance all vary between different batteries - even of the same type/make but different case sizes.

The batter gauge, and terminal voltage/state of charge is pretty much pointless. UNLESS you wait a full day.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 18:03

Remember here that 2C is 140Amps. And we need that to turn... And it only goes to 2 and a bit!


Image

Discharge voltages of a typical group 24 tubular low impedance deep cycle battery like an odyssey. An MK gel shows a worse performance than this at high discharge currents. Remember that we need nearly 200A to cross a threshold or turn iun place on a nose heavy rear drive chair for eg.

Remember that your chair wont move if it sees less than 18V typically.

Heres the same thing for a lithium cell... To follow.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 18:15

With lithium it doesent matter much what rate you discharge them. They give much the same Ah (the full rated or greater regardless.

This is a 100Ah lithium ion phosphate graph from victron energy.

.5C is 50A discharge, compare to the lead above!!!
Remember that 2C is 200A.
3C is 300A
5C is 500A discharge...

Image
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Fedor » 11 Oct 2017, 20:19

I am well aware of the benefits of lithium and plan a complete transition to them.
But at the moment I'm using the new MK Gel and trying to figure out what they're capable of.

Before that, I also used Gel, but from Eternity Technologies, it's a marketing datasheet: http://www.eternitytechnologies.com/wp- ... 04-web.pdf
I was not surprised that battery gauge is lying, but that it has changed from replacing the Gel of one brand, to the Gel of another brand (same capacity). This in my opinion is strange. I have another 3 months to return them under warranty, but for now I'm trying to figure out why this happened and whether I have the same capacity as before or not.

Remember that we need nearly 200A to cross a threshold or turn iun place on a nose heavy rear drive chair for eg.


I saw your video with measurements of current consumption when turning on a carpet, grass, and the like. But I now have a stock controller with 50A and bursts of about 75A, there's also a fuse between the batteries, which is definitely less than 100A. So, if I understand correctly, with this configuration, there's nowhere to take 200A. This is a technical limitation (and it's shit).

I understand that there are a lot of factors when using batteries. But in my case I just replaced the two Gel batteries (Eternity), on the other two Gel batteries (MK Powered).
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 20:33

Most powerchairs use a fuse that is considerably lower than the current that it passes. A fuse isnt a thing that pops as soon as it sees its rated current. A 50A fuse will take 150A pulses, 100A for short periods, and its rated value plus a little all day long. Your controller can demand 75 plus 75A from your battery. So you will get periodic demands for 150A.

I was not surprised that battery gauge is lying, but that it has changed from replacing the Gel of one brand, to the Gel of another brand. This in my opinion is strange. I have another 3 months to return them under warranty, but for now I'm trying to figure out why this happened and whether I have the same capacity as before or not.


This is what I am trying to explain to you. Its in no way strange. The batteries were a different make. They will be a different impedance, and different level of peukert to the previous ones. So the voltage depression caused by any given load mad be greater, and you may get less actual capacity from a perfectly healthy battery of the same or GREATER Ah capacity as the original.

I posted that chart comparison to show that the lead battery voltage and capacity drops away horendously under load. And every make varies. Theres only 2 batteries worth fitting in a powerchair, and those are both very low impedance for their cycle life capability.
The Odyssey is 68Ah battery for eg 2.5mOhm, and so suffers HALF the voltage drop under any given load, and the voltage recovers at twice the speed, compared to say the 73Ah MK. But its terminal voltage at a full charge is lower. So the gauge reads lower drom the start, sags less in the middle, and then the smaller batter will take you FURTHER as its resistance doesent increase with discharge level to the extent that the MK does.

Your gel batteries may well vary in the same way. I cant say because no spec sheet.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 11 Oct 2017, 21:08

Lets say that they are not as good as the starved acid MKs were. I already know this because they only have 450 cycles , and it doesent say if this is at the usual 80% Depth of Discharge or the sometimes used 50%. Lets hope its 80...

So they are likely using a less pure lead grid, with calcium or zinc added because its cheaper. And are getting the Ah they are rated for. They will likely not bethe starved electrolyte type because they would be offering 500 plus cycles. This means they are probably not as low impedance as the MK when fully charged, and will be lower than the MK when discharged since the acid isnt in short supply on purpose to protect the plates from deep discharge.

So these two batteries will undoubtedly show very different readings on a battery meter. But that has nothing to do with Ah. Or actual state of charge.

Lets say they have a lower impedance when discharged than the MK. This means they will have a greater capacity than the MK at HIGH RATE discharges. In other words, they may allow you to discharge them deeper because internal resistance holds up when discharged. Meaning that they have a better Ah capacity thats accessible to you at the rate you use them. But since we have no actual spec, the opposite may also be true...
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Fedor » 11 Oct 2017, 21:52

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Indeed, I did not think about internal resistance, but it is almost certainly different.
I will continue to observe and investigate this. In any case, the desire to switch to lithium is stronger.

But purely theoretically, can it be that I received a battery with a smaller capacity? Can it be a factory defect?
I'm not nervous about this, I just did not have too many Gel batteries to understand what defects are, and what they are not.
I bought a MK Powered (m24sldgft) battery from an authorized dealer, both from the same batch and I strongly doubt that it is defective, but still.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 12 Oct 2017, 00:11

Only one way to tell. You must measure it.

Theres a few things that can go wrong. There is a couple of cases on here if you can find it now, of people being given other peoples used batteries as new. Thats not easy to detect, other than by measuring capacity and/or looking at the date.

Also its possible but unlikely that you have a defective battery. Again, only testing properly, under load and capacity testing can tell. But this is highly unlikely. Although its quite possible that one or both were sat on a shelf for years. Then they gradually self discharge, and sulfate. This reduces capacity.

Its also possible that one battery had a higher state of charge when they were installed. And the next few charges in series would have leveled them up. But by then you would have severely overcharged one, and undercharged the other 10 or 15 times. Gel batteries, at least the starved acid (the acid gradually turns to water as it is discharged) 500 cycle ones from MK do not take kindly to overcharge. It dries out the gel, causes shrinkage and voids etc. Take a look at the amount of times it stresses NOT OVER 14.1V in the pdf document you linked to above. http://www.mkbattery.com/pdf/mktechm.pdf Shows this very clearly!

Chargers... Almost every mobility charger claims to be universal and that they can charge AGM or Gel, or any sealed battery. They do this with the CC/CV and sometimes float algo.2 or 3 stage. And they all charge the MK at too high voltage. Typically 14.4 to 14.5V per battery. So they charge at too high voltage. Its perfectly true, you CAN charge these at 14.5V as long as you dont care that it reduces service life quite markedly. See the chart on here showing the result of charging above the recommended voltage! You lose 60% of the battery service life, by charging just .7 volt too high. And the correct voltage is 13.8 to 14.1 MAX at 20 degrees C. So ideal voltage would be 13.95V. That meand that charging at the typical 14.5V per battery, is overvoltage by .55V at 2C. And by .75V at 25C! And by even more in summer at 30C... Whats more almost all of these chargers tell you its charged after say 8 hours overnight charge. Well its not! To fully charge, and so fully return all the sulfates back to the acid, requires 12 to 16 hours. Again shows this clearly http://www.mkbattery.com/pdf/mktechm.pdf

And so its quite possible that any of these things, and/or a couple ofthem is true. The charger one is almost garanteed to be true.

To test capacity accurately, I discharge at the 20 hour rate, and graph and measure the results using the PL8 charger as used for the lithium batteries. And I use them for a correct and full charge too.

Also I have these that show the same.
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK0.pdf same as yours, recently published
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK1.pdf ideal charge detail
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK2.pdf AGM and Gel tech sheet and differences
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK3.pdf sell sheet
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK4.pdf sellsheet
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK5.pdf sell sheet
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/MK-AGM.pdf MK AGM Battery, run away...
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/odyssey.pdf best lead battery available, and what I use in lead chairs. For fast charge, high current, sport, etc. These cost! Because this low resistance comes from more concentrated acid, and very thin 99.99% pure lead plates. So that impurities dont cause corrosion with stronger acid electrolyte.
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Re: AGM & GEL BATTERY INFO for POWERCHAIRS

Postby Burgerman » 12 Oct 2017, 00:44

As a note I realise that I have been using two words for years interchangably and its wrong!
Starved electrolyte and starved acid...

Sonenschein and MK gel, use a design that uses a weaker acid mix electrolyte. It allows the acid strength to decrease to the point where it prevents deep cycle damage and increases battery resistance as it becomes discharged. It effectively limits your discharge level and protects the plates. So the chair stops driving well before the battery is over discharged. Its why they can offer 500 cycles. So technically its starved of acid... Partly because the gelled electrolyte is immobile. And the acid is used up at the gel/plate interface. I write starved electrolyte incorrectly, and frequently for years.

AGM batteries use a fibre tissue (glass fibre mat) between plates. So that it cant spill. instead of mixing in gel crystals. It is refered to by many as dry, or starved electrolyte. Because theres not enough to spill... The mat is wetted with electrolyte only, but theres adequate so that the battery can be discharged deeply while still having low resistance in many cases. Like Odyssey.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby wilsonintexas » 27 Jul 2018, 22:11

Burgerman wrote:KEEP EVERYTHING HERE ON TOPIC!

: http://www.odysseybattery.com/documents ... 11_000.pdf
DO NOT BE TEMPTED TO FIT ANYTHING BUT THESE THREE ABOVE!


it looks like this link is broken......
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 27 Jul 2018, 23:55

Where from though? Cant find it.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby expresso » 11 Nov 2018, 03:52

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B015R9JJKA/re ... B008FY5UF8

IF someone was looking for lead for there chairs - would this be a good model to recommend ? this one is a bit less than the PC 1500 i have at 68ah - this one is 61ah - BUT i notice it looks to be a perfect drop in - looks like a good fit for a group 24 size -

i know for a fact the PC 1500 i have here - DID NOT fit in my 646 chair - but from the looks of this one - this model may fit ? i am asking to know so i can recommend it to someone who needs batteries - i am recommending Odyssey as there best choice or MK Gels -

what do you think of the above model ?
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby LROBBINS » 11 Nov 2018, 10:08

Tried to find information about the Odyssey Performance series - it's a bit thin compared to the what's available for the extreme, but I could find internal resistance values. The hype is that they are like the Extreme except that they have lower reserve capacity (something probably not of importance for us). The 61 AHr battery linked has an internal resistance of 2.9 mOhm. They also have a 64AHr model (physically larger, like the P1500) in this series with internal resistance of 2.3 mOhm. I don't know how that compares with the Extreme as I don't have the Extreme mOhm value handy, but John will surely know it right off the top of his head.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 11 Nov 2018, 11:34

That performance series are very slightly lower impedance than the other odysseys per Ah by the look of it. But a little less capacity, in different sizes... But not by much. So more engine starting power in a smaller package for race use. (You can still start a race car with a tiny lighter battery) but lose out on Ah. And so also reserve capacity. They are probably better for sport, or soccer as you can get as much current from a smaller lighter 60Ah battery. But less range. The 68Ah one many use here is 2.5mOhm.

Reserve capacity is actually quite a good way to compare all batteries as its a 25A load, and a measure of how long they can keep it up!
So this equates quite well to a heavy user in a 6 or 8 mph chair with turns and ramps etc averaged.

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/odyssey.pdf
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/odyssey-tech.pdf These are pretty much the same but with a different name as far as I can tell...
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby expresso » 11 Nov 2018, 17:02

ok thanks - the person wants a direct drop in - turns out her size is group 22NF -and dosnt want to add any other connectors etc, - just a simple drop in replacement - i recommended her MK Gel 22NF ,

what i wanted to know about this odyssey i linked was if it was a direct fit perfect size same as the MK 24 Gel - ? i was curious because it does seem to be on the picture compared to the extreme PC 1500 that i tried and was a bit larger
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby cavorite » 11 Nov 2018, 23:34

The Odyssey replacement for the 22NF appears to be the PC1200. Or will a larger size fit?
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 11 Nov 2018, 23:40

Theres no sensible 22nf replacement for the MK. Its an oddbalL size. Odyssey are primarily automotive batteries and so no group24 either. But in many cases their PC1500 fits. But they are 1 inch lower like a grp34, but slightly wider at the top.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby cavorite » 12 Nov 2018, 00:47

Research finds these measurements (mm, LWH)

22NF
240 x 140 x 227

PC1500
276 x 192 x 199

PC1200
200 x 169 x 193

Odyssey’s battery interchange guide says group 22 of any type is a PC1200. Group 24 is a PC1500.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 12 Nov 2018, 01:54

Dont know where you are getting these from but I know my PC1500s are not those dimensions.

They are 170 wide, and 260 long at the bottom. And they are wider in width at the top, by about 10mm. 275? Maybe. Reality about 270. But only at the top. So since many battery boxes are about 10mm oversized they can fit in place of a GRP 24 which is 260, 170, 240 tall max.

PC1200
7.87 (200) L
6.66 (170) W
7.60 (193) H

PC1500
10.86 (275) L
6.77 (172) W
7.95 (201) H

Heres a page with them all. These may show very slightly different metric sizes as they are calculated from the inch measurements instead of measurement. But super close!

Odyssey’s battery interchange guide says group 22 of any type is a PC1200. Group 24 is a PC1500.

Its maybe true for a car where the BASE is the fitting point. Its not true with deep cycle battery boxes.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby expresso » 12 Nov 2018, 02:26

the only issues i had with the PC 1500 not fitting my chair is the width on top part of the battery - so dosnt matter where the extra width is on the battery top or middle or bottom - it didnt fit my 646 chair - but i managed to stuff it in my P222se chair - it didnt fit well - hate to force it in place which means its not really the right fit - since that chair is mostly a plastic box - i was able to make it fit somewhat but the cover didnt close well. once removed and replaced with MK 24 - its a perfect fit - tight but just right - :shock: :thumbup:

but i managed and used them for one summer that way before taking them out and replacing them when i got new MK 24s instead - have them with a ADD ON - i wouldnt buy them again if i were still using lead - unless you know for sure they fit - not worth the work involved if they didnt fit. not everyone is going to cut there battery box or chair frame to make it an inch or two wider.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby cavorite » 12 Nov 2018, 03:37

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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 12 Nov 2018, 06:34

I think your pc1500 is including the side terminals. The marine, or the one without the side terminals is 171 wide. I just cut those off on the easy to get side terminal version. Either way the 1200 wont fit if your 22nf measurement is correct.

I use this. https://www.jegs.com/Sizecharts/bcigroup.html be careful, theres 4 grp24 batts all very similar. And 4 grp22 bats, the NF is thinner.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby cavorite » 28 Nov 2018, 03:05

The Q6 battery area is very tight on width. The PC1200 fits with room to spare, but the next size up wouldn’t work. (Going by measurements.) I’m still happier with this than using MKs.

Charger is set for 29.4 V bulk and 27.2 V float. (14.7 and 13.6)
Is this right?
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 28 Nov 2018, 10:50

Yes. What is important is the point where it swaps from CV (absorption) to float. That should be 6 to 8 hours, absolute limit, and 1000thC whichever occurs first.
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Re: PINNED - AGM & GEL battery info lead battery info

Postby Burgerman » 28 Nov 2018, 10:51

Yes. What is important is the point where it swaps from CV (absorption) to float. That should be 6 to 8 hours, absolute limit, and 1000thC whichever occurs first.
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