Resources for planing shower configuration

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Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 22 Nov 2017, 23:35

I'm hung up on the planning phase of shower remodel. I want to plan a roll in / roll out shower... because MS IS progressive. Right now I am using a shower seat in a dangerous (for me) tub shower combo.
The existing room is 4'11" X 7'10". It shares he long wall with a closet (4' X 7'10") whichj I am willing to break into, preferably at the back so there's some closet left.
My best current idea would be to create a wet area shower in the back... break into the closet some with a glass partition to minimize the bulk. I'm also considering cutting a port hole behind the toilet to set it back to gain floor space. I'm thinking the vanity cabinette should go & have a wall mounted unit again to clear floor space.

Your thoughts? Resources? Ideas sites?
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby ex-Gooserider » 28 Nov 2017, 02:39

A rolling shower-commode chair and roll in shower is the way to go as far as I'm concerned... I use a self propel Invacare "Mariner" chair.

My daily drill is to wake up, transfer to the shower chair and roll into the bathroom, park over the crapper and do my bowel program and morning cath... As soon as that is done, I roll into the shower, and scrub, then roll back into the bedroom, throw my clothes on the bed, transfer back onto the bed, and get dressed. Then I transfer into my manual to get around in the house...

Our redo of the bathroom was to rip out a closet in the bathroom to make a bit more floor space, and more importantly to make room for a wider door. We ripped out the existing bathtub / shower unit, which was a molded in one piece unit that had the standard size tub and surround all molded together, and simply built the roll in stall in it's place. We tiled the walls and had the floor re-tiled with extra cement under it to shape the floor to drain to the old tub drain connection.

The resulting space is not a lot wider than the shower chair, but is about a foot longer... We didn't put in grab bars initially as we wanted to see if they were needed - decided they weren't, at least for me. This was good as the bars would make the space a bit tight. We did eventually mount an extra heavy-duty folding shower bench at the far end for Mary-Anne to use, it doesn't get in the way as long as it's folded up, I wouldn't be able to fit if it wasn't..

So space wise, a standard tub size space will be OK, unless you want to have more room for any future caregivers that might be needed for assistance....

A few things I found useful that aren't in the standard guides...

1. Slope as much of the floor as possible towards the drain - it will help to capture any water that escapes, and more importantly also is handy if needing to clean up any "accidents" at the toilet....

2. Use a standard TUB fixture, not a shower fixture - this gives a handy spout for filling buckets or similar, and lets you run the water until it's up to temp without the cold shower blast...

3. Assuming you will be using a hand held shower, put the wall fitting where the hose attaches down near the faucet handle or about shoulder height when seated in a chair... Don't put it up at the usual fixed shower head height! Mounting the outlet low still allows the standing person to put the head up at normal height, but also gives you more usable length down low, which is good for reaching the back-end bits...

4. We put in 'cribbing' in between the joists at the two heights recommended for grab bars - to make it easy to locate later, when we tiled the wall, we used a contrasting stripe of tile over the cribbing - a decorative note that hides the secret wall reinforcing...

The other big change was to rip out the vanity cabinet / sink and put in a shelf with the sink mounted in it, which allows you to roll under it with a chair.

Putting shelves over the toilet helps provide replacement storage for all the stuff that normally got stuck under the sink. I also have a small plastic rolling drawer unit that I use for some of my other supplies and that we push around as needed...

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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby LROBBINS » 28 Nov 2017, 09:10

We have a roll-in shower much as Goose has described, but with one minor addition. For the hand-held shower I connected two lengths of the mounting bar together so that it can slide from very low for me (I have to be seated) to nearly that low for Rachi (she's in a semi-supine shower chair with lengthened legs to put it at decent height for those helping her) to overhead (for the TABs in the household).
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Sully » 04 Dec 2017, 22:09

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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 04 Dec 2017, 22:23

You have been denied access to the Adaptive Living Store Online Store on the basis of your IP Address (88.150.157.67) and IP Address Country (United Kingdom).
Only in america!
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Sully » 04 Dec 2017, 22:31

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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Sully » 04 Dec 2017, 22:35

John it seems like the computer networks are becoming more useless by the day. Give them all enough time and these geniuses will destroy the Internet completely. banghead
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 04 Dec 2017, 23:10

Many US sites block everything but US based IP adresses because they are for reasons that baffle me, terrified of someone from another place buying something. Likewise, if they dont block, they allow you to buy, and when it gets to the shipping page there is only US addresses/states. So no way to buy... Its like the US is all that exists.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 00:02

I don't get it. When I Googled the topic, I got US and UK sources. I probably wouldn't buy from a UK source... building codes and piping sizes are different but the IDEAS can be sourced anywhere. In fact my first couple of results were UK sources.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby elryko1992 » 05 Dec 2017, 00:40

Use a VPN for internet.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 01:22

I do. I am in any country or major city I feel like! :dance

Right now though I am in Berkshire, about 200 miles away from me.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 03:15

Thank you, thank you for this input. I'm thinking through everything you've said & will have specific questions after I take more measurements.

Yes, the one piece molded tub to be removed is a molded acrylic unit... which covers the end bathroom wall. The unit is 4'11" (the room width) and 33" deep. It will have to be cut up & removed presumeably leaving the same space vacant. Because it's the far end, one would have to roll in & make a 90 degree turn. Could it be done OR I hate to but I can break through into the adjoining closet to lengthen it. My thought is a wall mounted glass devider to keep the water mostly in the shower. I am thinking a wet room / wet area type shower.
Please, what shower length & width do I need to plan?

I've looked at wall mounted toilets (tank in wall) which gives most clear floor space and no penitrating the "tanked" sealed floor... but am really concerned about long term mantaince issues in the wall.
I'm considered carving a pocket / bump into the shared wall with the closet... to use the wall thickness... to set the toilet back for better floor space. I think it would still have a bottom outlet which would need to penetrate the "tanking" (sealing) of the floor (I'm thinking, wet room). It would be next to the shower.

The present vanity cabinette has a one piece molded top (23.5" x 31") which almost touches the door casing. I want to remove the cabinette & relocate the plumbing into the wall so the floor sealing can be uncompromised & allow roll under in the future. I mostly use the top surface & sink. I'm not at all sure what I want or need here.

The bathroom door is narrow 30"... I'm viewing it as straight in approach from outside. The present vanity is up to the door casing. I'm planning to go to a wall hung sink with nothing under to make clear floor space. So the door width will control the space for the sink. Do I need to widen the doorway? How much?
Because the bathroom door swings in currently... I'm considering:
A swinging out (would cover a window when open)
B a pocket door
C surface sliding dor
D a curtain with no physical door

The bedroom door is also 30" straight ahead in a 36" hallway... with the casing it is the full width of the hall. The far side IS the center wall where this modular house was bolted together. I don't know the structural ramifications of trying to widen that doorway. Is there such a thing as a casingless door?
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 07:32

Is there such a thing as a casingless door?


Thats just a hole in the wall?

You have no hinge or hardware attachment points. You could do it. My bedroom door and wet roomdoor swings both ways (no not like that!) so I just smash it open with the chair in either direction. urinal
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 07:45

Make america great again!

Actually the story of Pan Am.
Very interesting.


youtu.be/vPaCT0pMlQY
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 15:25

I am aware of bathroom doors which swing (or can swing) both ways after I saw them in hospital and medical buildings. If a person were to fall against the door, it could be opened in the opposite direction to gain emergency access. With my fall history I took notice! There is no hinge per say, but uses a top & bottom pivot so the door can swing. This type of non-hinge, probably requires an oversize door to meet commercial codes for clear opening... because the edge of the door remains in the frame area.
I researched as far as Stanley Rescue Harware https://www.stanleyhinges.com/Hospital- ... class.aspx

Since I am so pressed for door space, I'm still looking for less bulky ways of accomplishing this.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 15:47

https://www.gjohns.co.uk/hinges/self-cl ... sizes.html

Mine just uses these. They are sprung, so the door closes to centre every time, push to open each way.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 17:03

Ah, yes, in Ameri-speak, I'd call them cafe or saloon door hinges. They are available in a variety of designs & service strengths.
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Gatehouse-1-25 ... e/50056463

Then there's these lighter duty pin sets (among others) that popped in my search.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Prime-Line- ... /203032942
http://www.rockler.com/cafe-door-hinges

Either could be made to work if the opening is wide enough.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 17:18

Would anyone care to address if a 5 foot X 33 inch shower area perpendicular to the approach would be adequate room to turn into? Figuring half or less enclosed. I'd figure on a portable shower seat for now... and I will need grab bars.
Straight walls to the floor so full use of the space.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 17:39

With what though?
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 05 Dec 2017, 21:59

I am planning to continue to drag my non-functional side in as long as I can stand at all. I really don't know what equipment I could use when that changes because not only does the leg not work but that arm really doesn't either. Pretty sure I'd go in circles with a manual chair unless I had an attendant. Living in this rural area, I foresee many problems.
I'd have to aquire what ever equipment was needed.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Burgerman » 05 Dec 2017, 22:13

Plan for the worst. You may need to get a shower chair and a wet room in there and a carer. Best advice move to somewhere more suited before wasting money on adaptations that will not work later.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 06 Dec 2017, 01:20

I hear you. There are reasons to stay here. The point is to figure to how to make it work.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 07 Dec 2017, 01:31

Wife doesn't want to move. The tub has already had a crack patched & needs replacement anyway. If I were to move, the tub would need replacement to complete the sale. I need to make this liveable reguardless.
There's a tub in the other bath, so a shower would be fine for this one.
Nothing is forever & I don't want to break the bank with this remodel.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Sully » 10 Dec 2017, 19:04

Flagman, Can't blame you, moving residences especially when you must depend on others to move your "stuff" is a terrible experience at least for me it was.

When we bought this house all I "thought" I needed was everything on one level. WRONG. But that was not a thought in the wrong direction. But my next move was rather accidental I bought a low step-in shower (cheap 15 years ago) I installed it ( by myself) at that time. I knew my legs were failing me fast, but not actually why, I still don't. So I was kind of planning ahead. Since this was to be my retirement home, I was building for the unknown and unforeseen future.

It's my opinion we crips can build for ourselves and not decrease the value of our homes. Just about anything we do will increase the value by making the home more convenient for AB's, if we do it right. Wider doorways/doors, accessible bathrooms and showers are more valuable than not. I did buy a one level home but I did have a step down 9" into the back closed in porch, much later I had to install a ramp there. I bought an older home so the original front bathroom door turned out to be too small for my wheelchair, the whole bathroom is too small for my consistent use, but when I decided to use a back maintenence room as a full bath, I had luckily just enough room for an accessible shower and all. I won't try to tell you I was bright enough to know all this originally, but I did have the vision to imagine some of the future need.

So it is very easy to say move, and get something more convenient, or that will fit your needs better. There is far more than simply that, to relocation. :thumbdown: I get that. I cannot believe European people and the English Isles people are much different than we Americans are! Our friends and neighbors, mean a lot and are a big part of our support system, moving residences means leaving that behind, and creating a new support system. That takes a long time for some of us.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby Ayesha » 10 Dec 2017, 23:46

I'm surprised no one has suggested what I've had in my current and previous home -- a wet bath. I can shower on my toilet -- so convenient and saves transfers. Roll-in showers are notorious for leaking -- if you are going to remodel, wet bath is the way to go. Although I have a large bathroom, one of the advantages is that it can work in very small bathrooms.

Here's my article with more details and photos:
https://www.freewheelintravel.org/wet-b ... isability/
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 11 Dec 2017, 00:47

Appreciate the input.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 11 Dec 2017, 19:32

I did mention a wet room / wet area early in the thread. I think it would make the most of the limited space.
I am concerned that a bottom drain toilet will puncture the floor sealing (called tanking).
Alternatively a wall mount toilet which would not puncture the floor but also has both an in the wall flush tank & drain. I don't know anything about them but a flush tank problem in the wall seems nightmare-ish.
The in bathroom storage can move outside the room or onto shelves or a roll around.
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Re: Resources for planing shower configuration

Postby flagman1776 » 24 Jun 2018, 21:39

I thank everyone for their input & many tips have been incorperated into the plans. I am making scaled drawing for the contractor. There are good ideas competing for the limited amount of space & at some point decisions have to be made. I am planning a wet room with fully tanked floor, eliminating anything which might cause leakage in the future.

One area of concern is the bathroom sink / top. I had planned to replace with new & wall mount on brackets... deleting the vanity underneath for roll under access if needed. I notice Google images of "ADA compliant" sinks with redesigned vanities under... way under. I'd like to have some storage space... I probably could not reach it but the wife could... and wondered what my more experienced friends thought. Some configurations which "meet the rules" don't look workable.
https://www.google.com/search?q=handica ... 03&dpr=1.5
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