60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

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60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 03:50

OK - I got my cells alot sooner than i expected - and no connectors - i will take my time with this one - will update as i go along -

for now they look OK - i have to start charging them each - - i will measure each and order 1mm of PVC plastic i believe - someone had a link which i can order to size - then will wrap around with rubber silicone sheet - and use the Tape heat res. and try to make a Rice cake - as neat as i can -

i have a few things i need to figure out - first - the connectors - i guess i can use wires -

question is - would 8 awg wire be ok to use - and also the lugs i have wont work since they are 1/4 hole - i am not sure what size i will need - i am guessing its a 1/2 size hole -

which means i have to get new 1/2 size lugs for the wiring - connectors and for the balance wires - - so will take time to figure out and order etc,

for now - here are two pictures of one Cell -

this is going to replace the 36ah on my Lead chair -

BM any suggestions on the wiring size and lug size etc,

thanks -
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60ah Cell Side .jpg
60ah Cell Top .jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 09:07

First try to forget about prehistoric confusing inches. The rest of the world gave up on those when I was at school.

The connectors will be 8, 10, 12 mm since this was made in china. It will have M8, M10, M12 etc threads/nuts. At a guess, it may be bigger? Cant tell from a photo. So measure them.

Use cable the same size as the cable you used on the chairs previous addon or a little bigger. Again I dont understand your analog sizes. So same as you did before on the old addon connecting cables, but between cells. Preferably silicone as its more flexible and your terminals will be too close so the cables will be a U shaped loop.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby snaker » 28 Jun 2018, 09:39

Expresso, check the bottom of each cell first. As my terrible experience, the bottom might not be full wrapped. If so, fill it by electrical tapes (or something good for insulation).
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 10:30

2 to 3mm or 3/32 or 1/8th inch in analog ABS plastic or polyethlene sheet at the bottom.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 15:11

Burgerman wrote:First try to forget about prehistoric confusing inches. The rest of the world gave up on those when I was at school.

The connectors will be 8, 10, 12 mm since this was made in china. It will have M8, M10, M12 etc threads/nuts. At a guess, it may be bigger? Cant tell from a photo. So measure them.

Use cable the same size as the cable you used on the chairs previous addon or a little bigger. Again I dont understand your analog sizes. So same as you did before on the old addon connecting cables, but between cells. Preferably silicone as its more flexible and your terminals will be too close so the cables will be a U shaped loop.



i hardly know inches - never mind MM - when i search for things they come up in Inches mostly - MM for UK and overseas mostly

its a bit smaller then 1/2 inch so i am guessing now its a 3/8 size bolt - which can be 10mm if i correct - i dont have a MM ruler to measure -

i guess i stick with 8 AWG wire for the connectors - need to get new items lugs - etc, hope to get some things ordered soon
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 15:13

Burgerman wrote:2 to 3mm or 3/32 or 1/8th inch in analog ABS plastic or polyethlene sheet at the bottom.


https://www.professionalplastics.com/PL ... T-EXTRUDED

this would be good for the bottom and in between each cell - after i take the correct measurements best i can - will order cut to size
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 15:15

snaker wrote:Expresso, check the bottom of each cell first. As my terrible experience, the bottom might not be full wrapped. If so, fill it by electrical tapes (or something good for insulation).



yes your correct - not fully wrapped on the bottom - will tape it up once all done charging - by then i should have some items to start and put them together

not going to rush this - will try to make it as good as i can and neat - but i do like them -
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 15:22

Use multimeter. Check voltage from case bottom to each terminal. See if either is connected. I think it will be.

You need 9 of these for balance wires.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RED-10mm-INS ... Swl-BZql4L

And 16 of these
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-x-10mm-Cop ... 0005.m1851

And some black heatshrink.

And one of these cheap lighters. In the shops at 1.99 and refilable. I got 3.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Refillable-Win ... urbo+large
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 17:32

Burgerman wrote:Use multimeter. Check voltage from case bottom to each terminal. See if either is connected. I think it will be.

You need 9 of these for balance wires.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RED-10mm-INS ... Swl-BZql4L

And 16 of these
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-x-10mm-Cop ... 0005.m1851

And some black heatshrink.

And one of these cheap lighters. In the shops at 1.99 and refilable. I got 3.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Refillable-Win ... urbo+large



thanks i have the torch - heatshrink etc, - i just need to get the correct size lugs - for balance and wires - - have to check what i have in wire - may need to get more - i have alot of Marine Grade wire but its not flexable like silicone - i was thinking of using it since i have so much - but may be too stiff - i will test it first

i think 6 inch wire would be enough to make it work with a nice loop to it - no stressing it - if not - i use the silicone - i may try a 6AWG wire - thicker than i have used on my Full pack - just to see - actually i will check the nut with my socket set - see which size fits it - then i know for sure which size i need -

i found these for the balance wires -


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ring-Terminals ... %7Ciid%3A1


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Heavy-Wall-Cop ... aH6n-xNhXQ

these may work also -

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tinned-Copper- ... 0005.m1851
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 17:37

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Heavy-Wall-Cop ... aH6n-xNhXQ

With these you dont need to solder of crimped correctly. But you will be bankrupt.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 17:53

Burgerman wrote:https://www.ebay.com/itm/Heavy-Wall-Copper-Cable-Lugs-Ring-Terminals-Various-AWG-Sizes-Welding-Battery/380957309836?var=650293273565&hash=item58b2d33b8c:m:m3r6PK3UbZX9oaH6n-xNhXQ

With these you dont need to solder of crimped correctly. But you will be bankrupt.



yeah this is how it is here in the States - prices are ALOT higher than where you are - i could find cheaper ones also - once i know for sure the size i need - then i can figure out which ones i will get -


https://www.waytekwire.com/item/36566/4 ... ed-Copper/


https://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-DC-WIRE-TIN ... 0005.m1851
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 18:30

7 Cells in the Plastic Shoe box - almost fitted - but since the Cells were 36mm thick each - i have to extend it about an Inch - using another box to cut and connect - same way i had to do with the headways which were even longer than this 8 Cells -

but the height if just right so i can use the lid on top to close it - make a opening in the middle for the wiring to stick out for charging and Cable going to the Chair -

30mm thick would have been perfect to fit - - thats what i would need for my Group 24 Tray to fit 16 80ah cells - these dont fit in my battery tray - i tested them - - at least for my battery tray - i need no more than 32mm thick to fit 16 of them - i believe - 8 side by side -
Attachments
Plastic Shoe Box 7 Cells top.jpg
Plastic shoe box - 7 Cells.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 18:37

Box looks a bit fragile and small. Maybe you can find a close fitting rectangular rucksack type of bag. And just use duct tape on the pack or heat shrink.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 18:46

Something like this but black of course. The web and every street market has them in every size. Just leave a wire and connector hanging out. So you look like a muslim suicide bomber... :ak47 :hammer :ambulance

https://www.armyuniverse.com/media/cata ... live-c.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 18:48

Burgerman wrote:Box looks a bit fragile and small. Maybe you can find a close fitting rectangular rucksack type of bag. And just use duct tape on the pack or heat shrink.


it will be fine once i am done - that box will sit in a backpack - like my other ADD ON's - i use the same one and sit it inside - its strong - fits perfect - hangs on the chairs push handles - and then i use a strap to support it even more with the brace bar


https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00 ... UTF8&psc=1
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P222se Chair with 30h ADD On -.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 18:50

Cut those sticky out push handles off. And use two rubber caps.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 18:51

the 60ah i will make now will replace whats in there now - and will fit and look the same on the outside - but have 60ah inside :D

with headways the most i can fit in there is 45ah - 3 Rows of cells - so this worked out even better - and a bit shorter in length also -
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 18:53

Cut those sticky out push handles off. And use two rubber caps.

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1OWm1QFXX ... 40x640.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 18:55

Burgerman wrote:Cut those sticky out push handles off. And use two rubber caps.



i cant do all those things like you and others with cutting and welding etc, - for the most part - never get used - but they have been a few times indoors when something went haywire with the JS cable and had to free wheel - the girls can use them easier - some chairs you can get them cut from the start if you asked i believe

my new chair will be a bit different in that dept. not sure if it will look better or worse - but i had the brace bar put up going across between those two sticking out handles instead - and the reason was so i can the rest of the back free to hang another ADD ON if i make it for this chair without have the brace bar in the way -

may be able to sit it flush to the seat back - at least thats what i vision - how it turns out is another story
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 18:57

Burgerman wrote:Cut those sticky out push handles off. And use two rubber caps.

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1OWm1QFXX ... 40x640.jpg


actually i need those caps for my cells - have to do a search for some or try a hardware store -
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 19:07

I cut 7 inches from the push handles. Zoom in. They used to hit my PC when turning or gouge walls! Headrest bars needs shortening and pad putting on the right way up in this picture...
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headrest.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 19:48

taking a very long time to finish - the term. is set at 75mah - do you think i should up that to about 100 ?
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 20:18

Finally finished - i guess i will leave it and let it get a good first charge - it seems they were almost empty - about 55AH put back in -

now i am discharging it for a few hours - i guess i have to try to get one cell done in a day - and only if i am home to keep an eye on it
Attachments
Cell 1 - Charged.jpg
My workbench.jpg
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 22:38

Charge at 30A or more. Yes 100mA is ok. Even 200. We set it lower to be sure balance is accurate. And you are not balancing.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 22:58

Will do for the rest of them. Also I was able to discharge @ 10A a hours. I removed 20A stopped. Will start tomorrow again for next cell. 20A to charge is ok then that will take 5 hours I bet. Then 2 more to discharge. .
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 28 Jun 2018, 23:03

20 OK. 40A is OK too if you are in a hurry...
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 28 Jun 2018, 23:25

:thumbup:
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby shirley_hkg » 29 Jun 2018, 00:52

It's meaningless doing all these balancing things , when you are doing just 1P8S .
You'll take them all , good or bad anyway .

6awg (13.3mm sq ) wire for an add-on ?
You are making it unnecessarily difficult for yourself . :fart
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby Burgerman » 29 Jun 2018, 01:07

I agree,

>>> 6awg (13.3mm sq ) wire for an add-on ?

You only need about 6mm sq max.
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Re: 60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

Postby expresso » 29 Jun 2018, 01:18

8 awg wire is fine. 10 mm fits for the ring terminals. But in inches it's 7/16. So I have to use 1/2. 3/8 is too small will get some 1/2 lock washers tomorrow to be sure then order the rest of the lugs. Awg here no one understands metrics here with wiring. Like metric there what can I do. It is how it is. What is it that tool to use it figure out the size I. Metric again. ? I may just get one to have on hand. I am not good with either inches or metric. But inches is more confushing even for me.
Quickie P222se - 60Ah ADD ON
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