Spectra XTR2HD intermittently juddering

[Spectrapilot]

Hi (unfortunately) I use a 6 month old Invacare Spectra XTR2HD (with tilt in space) 24 hours a day but during the last month or so I've experienced an intermittent "judder" from the left side motor and it sounds like the electromagnetic brake doesn't release every time (1 click not the stereo sound when both disengage)
NRS have replaced the DX controller but surprise surprise within an hour, it's started again!!!
Has anyone any ideas what's going on as the engineers are pretty clueless.

[Burgerman]

Instead of blowing hundreds on a controller they didn't need why cant they just use a tiny bit of logic and a multi-meter and diagnose the ACTUAL problem.

Step one. Check for loose or burned or oxydised connections to motor as well as to brushes. Using eyes, and then by measuring as motor,and brake, is operated, and under load. Then you will discover if its a sticking brush, or a worn one, or a bad connection, or a sticking brake, or a bad brake connection, or a bad freewheel micro-switch, or a broken wire inside the insulation. Going by all the terrible crimps I have seen lately it could easily be a badly made crimp too, or a loose battery connection, loose fuse connection or connection to a thermal fuse if its got one (breaker). Juddering can also be a faulty brake, a failing motor or gearbox bearing, or a failing rubber cush drive (motor coupling) which I have had half a dozen times. They bulge under load and jam up in the space...

Only a real diagnosis by a man with some clue will tell you what is going on. Could even be a partly burned motor. Experience, logic, and a multi-meter can diagnose all. Or you can just keep swapping perfectly good parts'$ until you get there by guesswork.

Has anyone any ideas what's going on as the engineers are pretty clueless.

Any of the above. You can try all the easy stuff first and get lucky. But it really needs some diagnosis from a REAL engineer, not a delivery driver thats been on a day course. Let me guess, WCS?

[Spectrapilot]

Thanks for all the info & advice Burgerman - the company that supply my area for equipment are called NRS. The engineer is usually good at minor problems but on this occasion he simply walked in, listened to what I said, stated "the joystick controller is defective and needs replacing!!" Without even putting his clipboard down. From the initial call, his visit to "diagnose" to having the controller swapped took a full month!
Considering this Spectra was new in March 18 it's damn frustrating wondering if it'll fail completely in the middle of a crossing - could that happen or would it fail from stationary?
Thanks for the reply Burgerman.

[Burgerman]

Well since we dont know whats actually wrong with it, and nobody has bothered to find out or diagnose it, who can tell?

[woodygb]

Next time suggest he uses Tarot cards for his diagnosis.

[steves1977uk]

Thanks for all the info & advice Burgerman - the company that supply my area for equipment are called NRS. The engineer is usually good at minor problems but on this occasion he simply walked in, listened to what I said, stated "the joystick controller is defective and needs replacing!!" Without even putting his clipboard down. From the initial call, his visit to "diagnose" to having the controller swapped took a full month!
Considering this Spectra was new in March 18 it's damn frustrating wondering if it'll fail completely in the middle of a crossing - could that happen or would it fail from stationary?
Thanks for the reply Burgerman.

You do have a backup chair, don't you? Also please fill in your location in the forum's control panel.

Steve

[rover220]

itll be a motor issue of some kind. see it quite alot on the spectra.

[Burgerman]

2 POLE? not adequate on a nose heavy long rear drive chair.

[Spectrapilot]

2 POLE? not adequate on a nose heavy long rear drive chair.

Yeah I sit forward of the central point so it's front heavy and go through at least 2 front wheels/tyres a year.

[Spectrapilot]

Thanks for all the info & advice Burgerman - the company that supply my area for equipment are called NRS. The engineer is usually good at minor problems but on this occasion he simply walked in, listened to what I said, stated "the joystick controller is defective and needs replacing!!" Without even putting his clipboard down. From the initial call, his visit to "diagnose" to having the controller swapped took a full month!
Considering this Spectra was new in March 18 it's damn frustrating wondering if it'll fail completely in the middle of a crossing - could that happen or would it fail from stationary?
Thanks for the reply Burgerman.

You do have a backup chair, don't you? Also please fill in your location in the forum's control panel.

Steve

Nope, no back up chair as I use a custom base & back cushion for support.

[steves1977uk]

Nope, no back up chair as I use a custom base & back cushion for support.

What do you do if your chair is out of action for a month or more??? You need to have at least one backup chair, if not two. BM has 4 chairs in case one breaks down.

Steve

[Burgerman]

2 POLE? not adequate on a nose heavy long rear drive chair.

Yeah I sit forward of the central point so it's front heavy and go through at least 2 front wheels/tyres a year.

The problem is that this means that at EVERY TURN your motors ar maxed out and burning up with hundreds of amps. 2 poles put all of that through one set of brushes whech heat up fast! And /burn/die.

And yes. 1 backup chair isnt adequate because since as we know, shit happens. You are in your backup chair, and the other chair is waiting for parts/repair and it fails... Then what? And I have had this happen. So a 32rd or more is ewssential, esp if you need to service your backup chair and it in bits!

[Spectrapilot]

Nope, no back up chair as I use a custom base & back cushion for support.

What do you do if your chair is out of action for a month or more??? You need to have at least one backup chair, if not two. BM has 4 chairs in case one breaks down.

Steve

Hi Steve as my cushions and seating position are unique it's not practical (storage space and sparechair cost) to have a back up. I usually get an "upgrade" every 5 years or so as the foam carve & gel cushions deteriorate but in March the swap was a nightmare (incompetent engineers & OT) and after 3 attempts I had to settle for the cushions (base & back), footplate hangers & footplates, controller and push handles being put on the base of the new spectra with a view to investigate another seating system in the future! I was that annoyed I gave up.
Although the 5 year old spectra was pretty sound I've got the shuddering issue on the replacement.

[Burgerman]

Hi Steve as my cushions and seating position are unique it's not practical (storage space and sparechair cost) to have a back up.

Not only does it have to be practical, it is absolutely essential.

At very least a chair, that you can move your cushions etc to as needed.

When filming this I had 6. Since then I got rid of the STORM 4 and aquired a new Salsa... So still 6.
The one in the garage is no use to me and still for sale. 1000 with some spares. Even a spare controller, motors, cables, joystick, Brushless etc. Cheap!

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/gopro/6chairs.mp4

Salsa viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7455&start=600

[foghornleghorn]

Hi Steve as my cushions and seating position are unique it's not practical (storage space and sparechair cost) to have a back up.

Not only does it have to be practical, it is absolutely essential.

At very least a chair, that you can move your cushions etc to as needed.

When filming this I had 6. Since then I got rid of the STORM 4 and aquired a new Salsa... So still 6.
The one in the garage is no use to me and still for sale. 1000 with some spares. Even a spare controller, motors, cables, joystick, Brushless etc. Cheap!

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/gopro/6chairs.mp4

Salsa viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7455&start=600

Black chair = using
Green chair = unfinished
Storm 4 / new Salsa = spare
Black chair = broken motor
Black chair = spare
Storm 3 = spare but you say no use

I wouldn't count unfinished/broken as spare. You can't just swap cushion over jump in and carry on with your life. Might as well be 2 spares and 3 unicycles.

[Burgerman]

2 spares means 3 functional, and 2 awaiting finish or repair. Thats why you DO need a bunch of chairs!

The green one has a seat and footrest now though. And the brushless storm3 one can be used I just dont like it. So never modded it.

And now the house is fixed, and I am starting to get up again, a new motor will be fitted to the BM3 chair too. So will have 6 working chairs. 5 GOOD, and one for sale!

[foghornleghorn]

Going off at a tangent here now,,, House fixed and you are out of bed - do you think the house being damp and mouldy has contributed to you being unable to heal the sores?

[Burgerman]

No, the room I was in was always heated. I ignored the rest as I was stuck in bed. And unknown to me there was a leak in the roof pipework, soaked the walls at the front of the house where I wasn't, for 8 months...

[Burgerman]

All fixed.
Pics, before TV!
And my 55 INCH 4K OLED PC 3840 x 2160 MONITOR! That thing is gorgeous. Perfect blacks, infinite contrast, 11ms latency, true wide gamut, and can do the latest movies in HDR etc. Even the sound is great. As a PC monitor its WAY better than any PC monitor you can buy regardless of cost. Its like all the windows and icons are floating on black glass. Doesn't look real! Like a puddle. Stupid screensaver cut in here. So good that I had to get a 65 inch one for the living room... OLED makes everything else look as if its busted...