Soldering

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Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 03 Jan 2019, 19:11

Good soldering starter


youtu.be/nS0bEuYPJoA
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Re: Soldering

Postby martin007 » 03 Jan 2019, 20:05

You re-insert the video...
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 03 Jan 2019, 20:30

Yes. Also a warning about lead tin solder from china/ebay. Its too cheap!

I bought some 37/63 (sets more suddenly but still quite shiny) and some of my favorite 60/40 lead tin cored solder which is great for almost everything.
But they lie!

I swear this is lead free, it behaves like it, its dull and mottled when cooled, it sets too fast. And I had to turn my iron up from its 300 to 350C. Horrible stuff. My usual shiny smooth soldered joints look like grey "stone" when cool. And it melts suddenly goes like water and set too fast. Its suspiciously light too. Its going in the bin. I suggest you buy from a good source!
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 04 Jan 2019, 14:36

Just received my replacement solder.

This is the stuff I usually use. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HQ-Tin-Lead- ... rk:15:pf:0

This is 3 times as expensive than the usual eBay crap. The difference in use is night and day. With this everything melts, tins, and shines. The iron tins better. Everything better. I suggest as a do all, that you buy 1mm diameter and 250g reel. Thats not cheap at £19 uk pounds. With that its a bit big for small circuit board stuff, and a little small for bigger connectors or open wiring as you feed in long lengths. But its a good compromise. Or get say .6 and 1.5mm if you are rich.

This stuff is 60/40. And pure lead and tin. Not contaminated reclaimed junk. So unlike all the cheap Chinese reclaimed crap with other trace metals in it, like all cheap solder, THIS actually works as it should! Its also whats called FREE FLOW meaning its got an active flux, that still isn't corrosive. And unlike most solders on eBay it has a full 2.5% flux content. Not the usual 1%.

Yes its expensive. Is it worth the difference?
After using various cheap solders (I'm cheap!), and some that wasn't what it claimed to be, It is ABSOLUTELY worth it!

Its the difference between bad, frustrating birdshit looking joints, or solder that wont run/stick/work properly. And a blackened iron that wont tin or stay tinned and perfect easy, shiny connections with an iron that stays shiny!
It melts at 183c (as it should) rather than the 200 or 210c or worse of the cheap reclaimed ones.
And it cools looking like a smooth chrome mirror. I just threw away 3 other rolls of cheap solder. Till today, doing a few tests I would not have believed the difference. I used to think it was all the same. Wrong!

Marked as RMA (For Rosin Mildly Active, a slightly active cleaning flux). So it cleans, removes oxides when hot. Not madly acidic like plumbing fluxes, but designed for electronics. Yet it can be still left on joints or circuit boards once cooled without any corrosion.

RMA is a mildly activated, general-purpose wire solder for use in applications requiring good activation. RMA cored wire is active enough for excellent tarnish or oxide removal, and will produce bright shiny solder joints.


High Quality Tin Lead 60/40 Flux SW26 Multicored Solder Wire Cynel for SMD DIY etc.
S-Sn60Pb40 solder manufactured in the first melt of tin and lead according to PN EN 29453:2000 standard in continuous casting process in air-free environment; afterwards extruded, in order to eliminate oxide occurrence

S-Sn60Pb40 solder is used primarily in electronics industry, for production of standard equipment and electronic components, in electrotechnics industry and soldering of components.

Halogen flux SW 26 based on colophony modified by organic activators, marked RMA, according to DIN 8511 or 1.1.2. PN EN 29454. The basic non-corrosive flux applied to electronics and electrical industry. The residues needn't be washed away.

Chemical characteristics
Lead content 39,5 to 40.5%
Tin content: 59,5% to 60,5%
Melting point: 183°C to 190°C
Working Temperature: 320°C to 400°C
Density: 8,65 g/cm 3
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 04 Jan 2019, 15:46

The solder above, is a MILD ACTIVATED.
This one linked here is ACTIVATED (not mildly!) otherwise its basically the exact same thing although 37/63 instead. (same melt temp, but sets and melts more suddenly than 60/40).
Main difference is that instead of RMA flux its just RA. So a little more aggressive.

As in you get much better cleaning than the above solder, and more easy solder "flow". Its still 2% flux, (1% isnt enough. 3.3% is available, but much smoke!) So 2 to 2.5 is best for general purpose. Its also still pure lead/tin virgin metal, still expensive, and still very high quality. You wouldn't chose this on a circuit board as it is corrosive over time. Unless you wash it off. Its basically for soldering wires, connectors, or stuff thats less than perfectly clean.

If you dont use it on circuit boards, dont care if it eats the tip of your iron faster. And have any trouble soldering or repair things that are not new wires, used components etc, or oxydised wires, dirty soldering iron that wont tin easily, then you want this instead. But an electronics expert will look down his nose at you if you use it on a circuit board...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232235747877 .7mm
https://www.pcb-soldering.co.uk/autosol ... 2-lux.html 1.6mm (also .7.)
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 04 Jan 2019, 15:51

And in both cases you will want a tin of this.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01N1R7U6P/ ... B000X2ERU4

Flux. A mildly active, cleaning de-oxidising one like this. An active rosin flux for tinning, cleaning, and adding to wires, joints to get a smooth shiny joint and a tinned iron! Works great, I have a large tin of this. Not acid. Safe on everything.

This is quite sticky and stiff.

If you want an older brand, search fluxite, green tins, its similar, but thinner viscosity like axle grease.
This stuff here, but cant find a small tin! Enough here for 20 years. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fluxite-FLU100 ... ds=fluxite
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 03:42

Tips. For temperature controlled irons.

Throw away that pointed thin one many come with. I cant find anything thats actually good for.

In image below, theres some common tips. Starting from the left:

1. This is needed to solder say a thick wire, or a XT60 type connector. It has enough mass, and enough thermal and contact area to maintain some heat, as you try and heat a large joint. A smaller tip goes cold, and has inadequate contact area. Meaning you keep trying to turn up the iron temperature, to make the thing solder! That just burns the iron and then it oxydises, loses its shiny tinned end, and transfers even less heat. So buy one!

2. This is needed to solder general smaller wires, smaller connectors, through hole components etc. General purpose use. Buy one! Leave it on the iron. DON'T try soldering large joints, it wont work. You will end up turning up the iron temperature, burning off the flux, losing tinning, and getting worse heat transfer than before...

3. Good replacement for that pointed stock one. Its got a small 45 degree flat that allows some heat transfer. For tiny stuff, circuit boards etc. Buy one! Again, useless on bigger joints. You cannot transfer 60 to 100 watts via a point. And the sides are rounded...

4. If you have a 1. you dont really need a 4. But OK for slightly smaller joints.
5. Stock pointy one. Maybe useful on tiny surface mount stuff? Otherwise useless.
6. As 5. But a bit bigger rounded blunt end. But seems a bit more useless to me...

There are pointy ones with a tiny 45 degree flat at the end that seem much more useful. .5mm to 2mm flats. Not shown here. Dont file your pointed one, as you will file off the iron plating that stops the flux and the solder eating away the tip.
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6Pcs-Soldering-TIP-Iron-Tip-900M-T-Type-for-Hakko-936-937-928-Soldering-Station-43.jpg
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 04:10

Soldering is entirely to do with CLEANNESS.
Solder will not stick to a dirty or oxidized wire. Or iron. It will just “sit there” and the wire can be pulled out.
Solder does not clean a wire.
It is the resin or rosin - the flux, in the middle of the solder-wire that cleans the connection allowing the solder to work.
But the resin does not work unless it is heated and melted. Or you add some to the joint from the separate tin before trying to solder!

When you are soldering, you don’t want the solder. YOU WANT THE FLUX first.
But the life of the resin/flux is only 1 to 3 seconds before it has evaporated once heated.
This means you CANNOT transport flux on your iron.
By the time the iron has reached the connection, the flux has evaporated.

The flux only works when it is heated AT THE PLACE where the connection is to be made.
That’s why the iron must be as clean as possible by pushing it through the copper-wire ball or cleaning mesh.
The cleaning brass mesh/wool will remove the old solder and clean the tip. Wiping the tip on a wet sponge DOES NOT CLEAN THE TIP well. It leaves a fine film of contamination.

Place the iron on the joint to be soldered and immediately bring cored flux solder to touch the iron from the opposite side of the connection.
At the moment you only want the flux to do its job. Let the rosin melt and clean the components.

NOW YOU WANT THE SOLDER . . .
Add a little more solder and allow it to run all over the connection and make a smooth and shiny result.
Remove the iron and don’t move the connection for 3 seconds.
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Re: Soldering

Postby shirley_hkg » 07 Jan 2019, 04:39

Yes ,
I have a few of them , and the first right one is my favorite , not the horse-shoe tip .

You need a bit of solder at the tip to increase heat flow . Dry tip could hardly work .
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 06:00

Yes, thats why the iron must be tinned, so not overheated.
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Re: Soldering

Postby LROBBINS » 07 Jan 2019, 09:44

The very fine point is indeed useful for SMD, especially for multi-pin chips. For small wire joints I prefer a chisel tip rather than bevel tip, but that's just different strokes for different folks. I keep two irons on my bench - a WEP (Haako knockoff) with fine chisel tip most of the time and an old Weller with mechanical thermostat (U.S. Army surplus) with a larger chisel tip, and switch to the fine tip only for SMD. I also have a large chisel tip for the Weller with a notch filed in it so it matches both lands on 805 sized components if I have to remove one (and there's too much stuff nearby to use hot air) - not used for soldering, only de-soldering so I don't worry about the loss of iron plating.
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 10:16

God only knows how you see well enough for those SMT components!
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Re: Soldering

Postby LROBBINS » 07 Jan 2019, 13:49

Stereomicrscope - a large table magnifying glass would probably do as well, but I "inherited" a student-level scope from my ex laboratory.
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 13:59

Very nice!
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Re: Soldering

Postby LROBBINS » 07 Jan 2019, 15:18

I'll add: I only use an iron for SMD when it's just 1 or 2 components to do or a couple pins to re-work. Otherwise, it's all re-flow, in my own peculiar Mr. Cheapsate way. Because solder paste has a short shelf life even if kept refrigerated and required using either a stencil or very picky syringe work, I use 0.5 mm 63/37 solder which I flatten with needle nose pliers so it can't roll, cut into size for each component (usually 1 strip for multiple pins) with a scalpel, and stick to the board with sticky flux, then a bit more flux on component pins or lands and place them. Then it's into an ordinary toaster oven which I manually control keeping an eye on the second hand of my watch. Very tedious, but as the whole board is soldered all in one go (or 2 if double sided), a lot less time consuming than thru-hole soldering.
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 07 Jan 2019, 17:14

That is too fiddly and small for me to ever work.
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Re: Soldering

Postby LROBBINS » 07 Jan 2019, 17:56

I thought so too until I tried it.
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Re: Soldering

Postby ex-Gooserider » 11 Jan 2019, 08:36

If you do choose to use a damp sponge for tip cleaning - my preference as I think it does a better job of crap removal than the metal scrubbers - it is highly recommended to use distilled water to wet the sponge - the chlorine and other chemicals in tap water will eat your tips faster....

(BTW, I almost once earned a NASA 'satellite' soldering certification, and would have if the job hadn't ended the week before I was scheduled to take the required course... So none of my work made it to orbit, but I believe some was used in high vacuum applications at the Brookhaven particle accelerator)

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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 11 Jan 2019, 10:31

You should try a brass scrubber one. I used a wet sponge one for years. They seem much better for cleaning/tinning in my experience.
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 11 Jan 2019, 12:49

As a point of interest, I use this, as I have a tube left over from building race engines etc. I use it when fitting soldering iron tips. It prevents sticking, corrosion, and transfers heat across the sliding fit gaps. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Silverhook-SGP ... mic+grease

Think of it as copper grease, but this good to a ridiculous 1500C or stupid hot. Remember 800C is red heat. Turbos and manifolds glow red on full power. Its a non translucent, light tan.cream colored thin grease. Used on bolts/studs on turbocharger manifolds, and anywhere you need some high temp anti seize compound or lubrication. Brake pad rears, heating boiler burner components and sensors, or miniature jet engine tailpipe or combustion chamber stuff etc. I wouldn't go out of my way to buy this just for a soldering iron just to use a microscopic smear, but if you have some...
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Re: Soldering

Postby Mechniki » 17 Jan 2019, 23:33

Fiberglass Pencils. Every copper wire I have ever come across, every Vero board has had some type of varnish on the surface, the surfaces need to be cleaned, for Vero Board a fibreglass pencil does the trick (A set with stainless steel pen, brass pen. coarse fibreglass and fine fibreglass is about £10). For connectors many are pre-tinned, if they're not use Scotch brite it's like a plastic pan scourer only with abrasive dust. Clean with an alcohol prep pad or nail and file antiseptic spray, even kitchen towel and pure alcohol to wipe away any loose debris from the scotch brite, (scotch brite I think is the trade name). Use the scotch brite on any cable to clean off the varnish. The varnish is there to prevent oxidation.

I use RS components or CPC for soldering stuff. I have about 5 gas powered soldering irons. 1 RS Soldering station. 1 Mitsumi Soldering station (cannot supply the same heat as the RS components). My go to for soldering iron is a 30w Weller soldering iron. For your type of applications I would use high melting point solder it's on a black roll for RS and their normal solder is on a red roll. The difference between the two. More tin in the high melting point more flux and it smokes more. The high melting point solder is thinner than you would expect. If you buy a roll, sometimes it's easier and less fiddly, to wrap some round a small wire, creating a coil, and putting the coil inside a ballpoint pen (without the ink) so it can be used as a feeder.

The pointed tips are for de-soldering components stuck inside Vero board. Vero boards have lots of rows of copper separated into tracks, with many holes in the tracks. The holes vary in size. 1mm is common, but sometimes they are up to 1.2mm - their are country changes too. For installing IC's I would recommend that you buy the base that normally is an extra, IC's (integrated circuits) like transistors, diodes, micro chips are not fond of being over heated. The base is what you solder to a Vero board then push fit the IC into place. There are solder baths that can be used that don't hurt the chips, but expensive. But you can get a solder cup (for dipping large components like 40 swg cables) though I have never owned a solder cup.

Then there are heated air solder stations, they are absolutely fabulous, they normally have exhaust fans or an extractor fan. But again are quite expensive, and surprising they make a humming noise which makes me sleepy. But unless you are doing SMT (Surface Mount Technology) you shouldn't need one, unless you are thinking of repairing games consoles or phones. In most cases a DIY hot air paint stripper can make many repairs to SMT.

There are tip cleaners, the sponge that comes with a soldering stand, add a little tap water and it's good to go. There are things called Helping hands, not to be confused with the easy reach, that have a weighted base, and a couple of arms that can hold small wires in their own crocodile clips, they normally have a magnifier too. Their are better ones of those too, it all comes down to money. The best in my opinion is the spider, not sure if it is still made but I have seen similar cheaper knock offs. The spider has 8 arms, all with a flexible metal and a heavy base, normally pig iron. Buy a cheap bread board (not the electronics project board) for real bread. Preferably Bamboo. and screw the spider to it.

My preferred tip cleaner is one that tins too. But I have seen some brass wool ones in a little tin. Though if you cannot afford one, you can use wire wool, except the wire wool is harder than the soft brass solder tips. Solder tips may look like a shiny metal, but underneath the surface normally brass or something else. Cheaper Irons use steel, which don't hold solder as well as the brass ones. And if you can find them, I found tips made for Weller's made of 925 Stirling Silver.

There are de-soldering braid which is very useful if you over solder, that combined with a solder vacuum, but basically a reverse syringe with a spring in it that sucks up melted solder. Every thing here can be found on Amazon or Ebay, probably both.

(if any of this information is incorrect let me know, and I will edit it)
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Re: Soldering

Postby Mechniki » 18 Jan 2019, 00:30

High Melting point solder
https://www.amazon.co.uk/MELTING-POINT- ... int+solder
had trouble finding a roll of it
--------------
Vero Board
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vero-Strip-Boa ... board&th=1
__________
Helping Hands (expensive)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/NEWACALOX-Sold ... ping+hands
Helping Hands (Cheaper)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fancii-Light-H ... ping+hands
Helping Hands (Cheaper still)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rolson-Tools-6 ... ping+hands
__________
Tip Cleaner
https://www.amazon.co.uk/DroneAcc-Solde ... ip+cleaner
Tip Cleaner and Tinner
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Thermaltronics ... ip+cleaner
--------------
Solder Vacuum Syringe and Braid (not enought braid)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pieces-Solder- ... raid&psc=1
Desoldering Braid (i find it easier to use if you fan out the end) - takes less heat to remove solder
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Inch-Desolderi ... raid&psc=1
-------------
Fibreglass Pens, Steel and Brass (to prepare surfaces)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Amtech-R0285-S ... ss+pencils
My personal favorite fibreglass pencil
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Modelcraft-PBU ... ass+pencil
As that is good for polishing mobile phone charging sockets (but you should use an air duster after)
-------------
Scotch Brite
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Preparation-Sc ... BQZA9GT3HN
I like the red one
__________

Alcohol spray for cleaning off the debris from Scotch Brite, fibre glass etc
https://www.amazon.co.uk/LINCSPRODUCTS- ... ohol+spray
as the nail and file antiseptic spray has changed it's ingredients
if you want a heavier duty cleaner similar to this, USE IN A WELL VENTILATED AREA
Naptha (I am not posting the link because it very dangerous)
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 21 Jan 2019, 14:49

Also needed now and again, is this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/272882522849

Search tip tinner.

Theres loads, all work, and restore old black burned or oxydised soldering iron tips that wont tin any longer back to as new state! Works like a charm.


youtu.be/WFaOPb017FM
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Re: Soldering

Postby Scooterman » 16 Feb 2019, 11:32

How on earth do you folks solder banana plugs? I bought 4 x AMASS shrouded to make up an PL8 XLR charge cable and direct to lead acid battery charge cable.

But I had a devil's own job trying to solder them. They are good quality but conduct my soldering iron's heat away, and I couldn't get the solder to run. Looking at the banana plug mass of metal, I thought that might happen . In the end I had to shield the cable insulation with silver foil and use a blow torch. I didn't want to use a blow torch but couldn't get the solder to run any other way. It worked and I used self amalgamating tape to tidy the job up, but have you got a better method?
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 16 Feb 2019, 11:41

I solder those with my iron. Quite easily. Set to 400C for large stuff. Tell me what iron are you using, was it properly tinned, sensible sized tip, did you use some flux?

https://www.ebay.com/p/10pcs-Red-black- ... 1883491466

These? Are the only ones you should use.
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Re: Soldering

Postby Scooterman » 16 Feb 2019, 11:58

Hi BM, I still using that old iron I posted a photo of a few weeks back. I think Shirley has got me a soldering station, and am guessing he'll post it when he's got the 24v power supply I also asked him if he could get for me.

What I've done is okay for now, but I will redo them when I get the soldering station. I'm always worried that if I apply heat to any electrical terminal for a length of time then the plastic will start melting. :thumbdown:
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Re: Soldering

Postby Burgerman » 16 Feb 2019, 14:12

Hi BM, I still using that old iron I posted a photo of a few weeks back.

If you can actually solder anything at all with that I would be amazed.

:clap

Also I use a tiny pencil flame lighter when the iron isnt man enough. Its accurate and easy.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Refillable-Win ... 5WEKJG3M09
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Re: Soldering

Postby Scooterman » 16 Feb 2019, 14:30

Ooh good idea I might get myself one of them :thumbup: . I could use it to light my cigar :joint
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Re: Soldering

Postby Scooterman » 16 Feb 2019, 14:40

Old faithful :D
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Re: Soldering

Postby Scooterman » 15 Mar 2019, 21:45

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