BREXIT

[Gnomatic]

On this side of the pond we haven't been hearing much on the Brexit situation. What's going on with boarder control, and where in your opinion does that seem to be headed?

[Burgerman]

I have no idea!

Nobody here cares one bit about a German family, or Spanish family moving in next door. Its the fighting age men, 4 to a room, Somalian or middle eastern Muslim's that we don't want. We don't want 17th century 3rd world savages by the thousand that we now call gimigrants. Because they just want whatever then can get. But we are not "allowed" to say this... So we have to call the problem immigration, border control, etc. So the ones we don't care about get targeted too. This is the result of political correctness by liberals for 50 years. So who knows.

[Gnomatic]

Okay, I get that. So lets take it a step further, what happens if the Scots declare independence and (re)join the EU?

[Burgerman]

Theres about 6 people live there. I couldn't care less. In any case that sturgeon woman winds me and most of the scots up. She has a one track mind. Independence. She did a referendum already and lost. And will continue to do so. And it was decided already. And now all the newest polls say that:

a) if rerun the result would be to stay in the EU. Bigger no than before...
b) the polls say that the people have had it with referendums and they did their once in a generation vote, and decided to stay in the UK... They do NOT want another vote anyway.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-39264468
4 out of 5 say no to new scottish referendum...

Leave the UK?
https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/03/15/sc ... -57-yes-4/
A couple of weeks ago...

No way.

[Gnomatic]

Interesting. Does the EU survive?

[Burgerman]

Not in its current form. Without de centralising and giving power back to the countries, and getting rid on the euro. But thats not the unelected EU project leaders plan. So I dont think so long term. They will plough on head in sand till it collapses.

[Sully]

The way I see it, there are several basic things necessary to make a Union of independent states into a single republic.
1) A thoroughly democratically chosen Constitution, by every nation involved in that Union.
2) Democratically chosen/elected representatives from each member states to govern/manage that Union
3)A well defined land mass to be communally governed by that Union. Preferably all within the same continental boundaries
4) a common currency
5) a common national language
This last one, is perhaps the most difficult to achieve. However, the language issue could be/would be, only for the legal documents and legislation, used by all member states, not necessarily the citizens of any single member state. And during any discussions in parliamentary discussions as well.

There are many reasons for every consideration. A Constitution limiting the vested powers of a national government. delineating the terms of every elected official, Limiting the unelected officials to an amount necessary to administer the departments necessary for operating such a Union. Any increase or decrease in the original number of departments (elected or unelected positions) should be done by national referendums (ballot vote) As well as the many issues member states see as detrimental to their states wrapped into such a Union.

But a contract agreement (constitution) with every participant state's approval designed to protect that Union from any other nation, member or non-member. Creating a common all encompassing Defense force made up of membership from every and all member states. I particularly like the posse comitatus act which prohibits the use of the combined Military within the National borders as a National police force. Let every member state be responsible for those issues.

OK enough of this shit. You get the idea.

[Burgerman]

1 and 2 will never happen, as the whole thing is steered and controlled by a bunch of socialist loonies that want a united states of the world with free and shared everything with as many races/religions/colours/cultures as possible in some crazy attempt to ruin all the decent stable, educated, richer countries.

3. Ever absorbing more and more poorer and less cultured backward countries like turkey (next...)

4. A common currency cant work across diverse countries with different levels of prosperity. EG the greek would LOVE to devalue their currency, to allow them to sell and compete with the rest of the world. But they and most of the poorer countries cannot and so are screwed. Great for germany however as theirs is artificially low. So that will soon collapse. The Euro. Massive mistake that we wanted nothing to do with.

5. Thats not going to happen either.

Constitution? Bad idea. You cant even control your own borders or guns because of it. Welcome to the ever increasing Muslim infestation problem!

[Burgerman]

Why would Grexit benefit the Greek economy, at least in theory? If Greece had its own currency, the exchange rate could go down and make its exports more competitive and imports into Greece less competitive. Locked into the Euro, however, Greece can restore external balance only by cutting its wages relative to Germany and other surplus countries. That has been happening slowly and painfully through soaring unemployment (about 25% overall and about 50% for young people). As a route to restore competitiveness, it is far preferable to devalue the currency than to lower relative wages through unemployment. If Greece left the euro it would no doubt have a currency set at a more competitive level relative to the euro.

It's one thing to devalue a national currency when everyone has contracts, pay scales, etc. that remain denominated in that currency. It's quite another thing to create a new currency. Imagine the chaos that could ensue if everyone decided to renegotiate all those arrangements.

After it joined the euro and until the global financial crisis, the Greek government and private sector could borrow at virtually the same rates as those in Germany. Greece ran an increasingly large trade deficits financed by capital inflows from Germany and other northern European countries that were running increasingly large trade surpluses.

The run to transfer bank deposits out of Greece has been destabilizing for the Greek economy in recent months (as it was in 2012). Whenever a devaluation is feared, middle class families with savings join big financial institutions and the wealthy in transferring funds out of a country. If Greece were to exit the euro, financial players would worry that the same could happen to Portugal, Spain and Italy. For that reason, no one in power in Europe wants Grexit.

[Gnomatic]

If Greece were to exit the euro, financial players would worry that the same could happen to Portugal, Spain and Italy. For that reason, no one in power in Europe wants Grexit.

Why does Greece even want remain in the EU? It's killing them economically. This was always going to be the case, that some country or countries being squeezed, as long as the EU remained a a monetary union but not a fiscal one.

[Burgerman]

Why does Greece even want remain in the EU?

It doesn't. Nor does it want the Euro. It want its own currency so it can devalue it and become a country that can build stuff, start businesses, employ its 30% unemployed, and become profitable instead of relying on EU handouts. But the EU now OWNS it as it owes so much. And the EU ignores any please to allow it to control itself.

Before it gets into that much debt, (as Spain and Portugal are already) Italy will likely get the 5 star movement into power and dump the Euro. For similar reasons. That may also end the EU as it is now.

The countries that were paying in most of the money IN were the UK, France, and Germany. These are basically subsidizing the rest, and they are having to do so, but can afford to because they were the ones doing the best. UK because it WASN'T in the Euro, and the two richest countries, France/Germany because they benefit from a net low value euro across the EU as a whole. So, now the 2nd biggest contributor (UK) is going, they are going to struggle to find the cash! And if France goes, later this year (le pen) then thats it for the Euro and the EU.

[Sully]

Any law is only as good as the enforcement of that law. Same for financial policies. Europe has No sense of brotherhood, or much of anything else for that matter. Turkey is a mostly Asian nation. There has always been discussion about this. If all Brits were like you John your nation would also be instilled in the stone ages as well. You have a slight border problem because you are 100% surrounded by seas if Scotland were to secede, that may well burst that dam, and Great Britain will become vulnerable to the less fortunate hoards from the East.

[Burgerman]

How?

(Scotland will not go its own way. But if it does, I doubt we could tell. Theres not many, and its all hills, flies, sheep...)

[Burgerman]

Nigel Farage:
The Moment I Grew To Despise The EU. When Nigel Farage became an MEP, he was a fan of the EU. He explains the moment that turned him against it forever.

He said: "In 2005, the European Union had produced its own constitution. The first proper blueprint. The first genuine admission that what they were building wasn't a free trade zone, it was a state. And they put it to referendums.

"The French rejected it, the Dutch rejected it and many other people had they had the chance would have rejected it.

"And what did the EU do? Did they learn the lesson? Did they say "Oh well obviously people don't want a state with a flag, an anthem and an army." Did they row back? No, they re-branded it as the Lisbon Treaty. They forced it through without giving the French and Dutch another option. The Irish voted against it, but were forced to vote again.

"And from that moment, I have been an enemy of the entire project.

"I think it is not only undemocratic, I think actually it is dangerous. I think if you suppress people's ability through the ballot box to make their own decisions, to be in charge of their futures, you will lead directly to political extremism and violence.

"And I don't care what Mrs May says, I think let's make Brexit a success. And let's encourage... Let's get the whole of Europe to leave the European Union and let's have a better European future."

[Burgerman]

Nigel Farage:
The Moment I Grew To Despise The EU. When Nigel Farage became an MEP, he was a fan of the EU. He explains the moment that turned him against it forever. http://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/n ... -eu-enemy/

He said: "In 2005, the European Union had produced its own constitution. The first proper blueprint. The first genuine admission that what they were building wasn't a free trade zone, it was a state. And they put it to referendums.

"The French rejected it, the Dutch rejected it and many other people had they had the chance would have rejected it.

"And what did the EU do? Did they learn the lesson? Did they say "Oh well obviously people don't want a state with a flag, an anthem and an army." Did they row back? No, they re-branded it as the Lisbon Treaty. They forced it through without giving the French and Dutch another option. The Irish voted against it, but were forced to vote again.

"And from that moment, I have been an enemy of the entire project.

"I think it is not only undemocratic, I think actually it is dangerous. I think if you suppress people's ability through the ballot box to make their own decisions, to be in charge of their futures, you will lead directly to political extremism and violence.

"And I don't care what Mrs May says, I think let's make Brexit a success. And let's encourage... Let's get the whole of Europe to leave the European Union and let's have a better European future."

[F3Head]

Ever closer union are the words Brussels's bureaucrats like to use. First they have to stick it to the UK. The ever powerful EU needs to make an example of the UK so that no other nation attempts it in the future. Once they do so it's full steam ahead.

The French elections pretty much ensures that the greater EU prevails. PM Teresa May, who stupidly called for early elections, will probably craft an agreement for Brexit that will pretty much declaw anything that you might achieve by leaving the EU. You will likely have all of the liabilities of Brexit and not any benefit that resembles the original version of Brexit. For example, you'll see no reduction of illegal immigrants in exchange for travel privileges in the EU or something similar perhaps in exchange for access to the common EU market. What will happen to millions of UK residents living in the EU? Once the German elections are over in the fall you can be sure Chancellor Angela Merkel and her French poodle Prime Minister Emmanuel Macron will get down to business immediately (you can never be too safe or sure in elections). Best to be reelected and then do the deed. In the end you will have an EU totally dominated by the French and the Germans. The other 26 or so nations of the EU will just be talking sock-puppets nodding their heads and parroting the EU propaganda. Get ready for more bailouts and illegals and terrorism heading your way. And as always please pay your fair share!

F3HEAD

[Burgerman]

Teresa May, who stupidly called for early elections, will probably craft an agreement for Brexit that will pretty much declaw anything that you might achieve by leaving the EU.

She WANTED the result she got. She wanted to lose her majority. She and almost every politician is a pro eu remainer.

All of them are liberals along with the media. She wants the result she now has to deliver, because the "hard" (read leave the eu) full brexit we voted for, was an act to pacify the voters that voted leave.

It was all a sham. So they could wear us down over time, and sneak in the "soft" brexit, parliamentary voting and interfering, and allow free movement, stay in the trade agreement, etc. So its now all OUR fault because she didnt win a majority. Guess what.

She purposely ran a non campaign, and tried to stop as many house owners from voting conservative as poss! The care tax that takes your house value away, the pensions, the fuel payments. Why do you suppose she shot down her own votes with that socialist farce??? Why do you suppose she was MISSING for the whole pre election campaign, wouldn't go on TV. She WANTED that result, it was all planned. To take away the pro Brexiter's power.

which all really means nothing now changes other than we no longer have a seat at the table. We still have open borders, hundreds of thousands of immigrants mostly black or Muslim, and the same crap we had before. And the liberal ruling classes and media are happy. We need farage back.