I voted leave part 2

[Burgerman]

And the 3 year remainer time wasting traitor may is now gone.

If the conservatives dont want to be totally destroyed, they must now put in someone that leaves, no deal, immediately, 2 years late. Or farage will be next in power in a few months. Or corbyn, which will totally destroy the economy after approx 4 to 6 years. As always.

And before you start with the parliment must agree stuff, its not true.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics ... e-minister

[wheelie junkie]

https://smallbusinessprices.co.uk/brexit-index/ Listed by region, company. can't all be attributed to Brexit and we don't know the reasons but the jobs are gone. Lowest level of business investment for years https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-brita ... KKCN1QZ007

Employment should rise if EU workers leave and fewer come here, more jobs than people especially in tourist areas with fewer EU workers here.

We have not left yet and as we don't know what will happen the economy ticks along, comparisons with other countries pointless, they have their own problems, welcoming so many immigrants has cost Germany a lot.

And the 3 year remainer time wasting traitor may is now gone.

If the conservatives dont want to be totally destroyed, they must now put in someone that leaves, no deal, immediately, 2 years late. Or farage will be next in power in a few months. Or corbyn, which will totally destroy the economy after approx 4 to 6 years. As always.

And before you start with the parliment must agree stuff, its not true.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics ... e-minister

Haha, the Express FFS of course MP's can stop it, a vote of no confidence in the government needs a simple majority of remainer MP's to stop it. Corbyn tried it but Tories wouldn't support, if it meant stopping a no deal Brexit they would. Basic political procedure if I can work that out I'm pretty sure remain MP's will.

[Burgerman]

Not only express, also the guardian, and then obviously the BBC said the same thing since they all read the socialist rag to get all their 'information'....

In any case, its irrelivant. Parliments power is given by the people. Who are rather unhappy at those in parliment. They are being shown exactly what the people think by the vote yesterday. I predict ZERO wins for the UK for the conservatives, and all the rest in embarassingly low figures. The BREXIT party, stand for NO DEAL with murder all the others put together. And in the next general erection the same will happen. Just wait.

As it happens the express is mostly right about all political stuff. Its the only non lefty remainer paper that isnt totally extreme liberal/left like the BBC/Guardian/metro, etc. Cant stand to read those obvious propaganda papers. So I go to the express first.

[wheelie junkie]

Well as I demonstrated with a way to stop it experts aren't always right no matter what the publication.

A general election will result in no party getting a majority, almost certainly a coalition possibly Tory/Brexit party. The 2 big parties will suffer, but how remainers vote will be the unknown, probably split between Lib Dems and Green and that is going to be the deciding factor. When you piss off an electorate there has to be consequences and pissed off people will go out to vote. Remainers don't have that anger driving them to vote so it is relatively obvious that the Brexit party will win seats in England, they'll probably not field candidates in Scotland, N Ireland and Wales. Personally I hope that it shakes up our political system and we see real change, parties having to work together so no lunatics like Corbyn getting what they want. Leaving the EU doesn't bother me one way or the other as our problems lie with us and the idiots we elect.

[Burgerman]

The tide is beginning to turn. As I said it would.

Conservatives are being punished with single figure % in the EU polls.
May is gone. As will all her replacements (in all parties) unless they do as we instructed them to do.
Liberals are a waste of time and Vince Cable gone...
The new breakaway 'change' party made up of a bunch of black/bonkers/liberals/lefties remainers, are dissapearing up their own backsides with almost no votes at all.
The labour party are doing the best but corbyn will soon be gone as his party is split and also polling really low since he is basically a comunist/socialist that will destroy the economy, AND is both remain and leave... Somehow.

On sunday, there will be the results of what amounts to the 'peoples vote' in the guise of the EU elections.
Farage, with a 5 week old party with no manifesto, no real party structure, other than LEAVE NO DEAL NOW will get more votes than the rest of the candidates put together. I cannot wait to see the politicals faces after sundays results. And if that doesent send a message to the idiots in parliment, then they will soon be booted by the electorate...
The success of farages voting, gives the conservatives the kick and legitimacy they need to have a actual brexiteer as leader. And stop pandering to the referendum losers.

Every 'leader' they put in will fail unless they figure out that they work for US and we voted out... And STILL they dont get it. The public are waking up to what the EU really is. The cork is out of the bottle. You cannot put it back. This is happening across europe.

People dont want globalism, open borders, centralised control, loss of sovereinty. And they are clearly sayng so in every last EU country. Watch who gets into power in the EUSSR across the whole EU on sunday. We just need to dump macron and replace with le penn and thats the EU screwed.

[Burgerman]

And this stuff, happening today, is just a tiny part of it.

A muslim immigrant from africa with nail bombs. https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/11 ... ror-threat

We all love to have all this cultural diversity to 'enhance' our lives right?
Merkel / EU has a lot to answer for. The last extra problem we needed was a mass influx of religous lunatics from places where life is cheap. But hey everyones is equal/same right? They wont mention the word muslim. They will call him a terrorist, a fundamentalist, mentally ill, an islamit extremist. Again all designed to show how cuddly the real muslims are. When its quite the opposite.

Wait for sundays results, to see the power of the people. And they are only just starting to wake up.

[wheelie junkie]

Unfortunately the people are gullible believing that a vote for an MEP is some form of second referendum, it wasn't it was to elect one of those unelected EU bureaucrats. It does indicate the level of anger at the referendum result not being implemented but not the level of support for remain. The only way of finding out is a general election and seeing whether the balance between leave and remain MP's changes enough to get a majority in the house one way or the other. With a first past the post system rather than PR that is never easy to predict, you can have strong support but not get seats as UKIP did in the past.

Inevitably it will end up with coalitions either Leave or Remain but should get us out of the stagnation we are currently in. Solves one problem but if it means Corbyn in power adds a bigger one.

The only way to break the deadlock is that general election and even then you can't trust the manifestos, just non binding political statements which end up as empty promises, at least the Brexit party will be simple. The same goes for the next PM, you can't trust the likes of Bojo, he'll say anything to get the job and renege on it once he has it.

The political system has to change - PR, coalitions and direct democracy for big issues stopping the likes of Corbyn stupidity , real people power only then will we really have control.

[Burgerman]

Unfortunately the people are gullible believing that a vote for an MEP is some form of second referendum, it wasn't it was to elect one of those unelected EU bureaucrats.
Yes it was!
It simply confirmed the strength of feeliung.
And those are not the unelected beurocrats we are refering too.

It does indicate the level of anger at the referendum result not being implemented but not the level of support for remain. The only way of finding out is a general election and seeing whether the balance between leave and remain MP's changes enough to get a majority in the house one way or the other. With a first past the post system rather than PR that is never easy to predict, you can have strong support but not get seats as UKIP did in the past.

We were already asked. The referendum said leave. We dont need any general election, and if we have one it does not overule the referendum which was a single question on a single subject.

Inevitably it will end up with coalitions either Leave or Remain but should get us out of the stagnation we are currently in. Solves one problem but if it means Corbyn in power adds a bigger one.

Corbyn wont win. The brexit party will. Leave, no deal ASAP.

The only way to break the deadlock is that general election

There isa no deadlock. Just a refusal by traitors to leave as per the vote.
Once booted out, no problem.

and even then you can't trust the manifestos, just non binding political statements which end up as empty promises, at least the Brexit party will be simple. The same goes for the next PM, you can't trust the likes of Bojo, he'll say anything to get the job and renege on it once he has it.

Referendum was leave. Manifestos are not relevant.

The political system has to change - PR, coalitions and direct democracy for big issues stopping the likes of Corbyn stupidity , real people power only then will we really have control.

Corbyn will be booted, labour wont win, and the brexit party will. Have faith in the system.

[wheelie junkie]

The only way you can get what you want is by a change in parliament and booting out can only be achieved by an election. There is no other way MP's have to be changed. And there is deadlock hence Brexit date being extended. Eventually leavers or remainer MP's will get a majority and then something will happen. I doubt that it will be one party, members of different parties who want to see Brexit happen will work together.

[Burgerman]

It doesent matter what 'they want'. Only that we instructed them as civil servants to leave. 3 years ago. Remainers should have all resigned when they lost 3 years back. Or did as they were overpaid to do. But it seems that we have to wait a while until the public get rid. The remainers should pe sued for the cost of all the uncertainty caused by them not doing as the country told them or as they stood for in the last election. Because they are the problem.

Theres nothing hard or complicated about leaving. 30 seconds is all it takes.

[wheelie junkie]

No-one will resign because representing your constituency is more than Brexit. Brexit is a once only event ,an MP is elected for 5 years. We have procedures based upon 100's years of democracy and fortunately/unfortunately they have to be followed or changed democratically, you might not like it but that is how it is. I've got no doubt we will exit the EU but it is going to need an election to remove those MP's.

[Burgerman]

I dont think so. They will not dare pull the plug, which means we are out with no deal in october. And farage has made the conservatives accept and understand that a no deal is what most of the voters want. He has put that back on the table in spite of the parliments 'advisory' voting.
He has DOUBLE the votes of labour, conservatives, or liberals... Because he has a single aim. Out, no deal. And nothing else. Say what you want, but if the conservatives elect another remainer leader farage will take all the votes in a general erection. And they all know it.

Also socialist governments are spreading across europe. It will become poorer over the next decades. I want no part of it. Capitalism, free markets and freedom all the way for me. So its ESSENTIAL to get out of the socialist superstate.

It always baffles me how any sane person could vote for a sociaist like corbin.

Then I realised that most people are pretty much clueless about, EVERYTHING, while being absolutely sure they are not...

[wheelie junkie]

A no deal PM will get close to 31 October and if looks like no deal remainer MP's will call a vote of no confidence in the government forcing a general election instead of allowing no deal to happen. That is already being talked about before they elect a new leader. It'll give you the election you want and need to change parliament then you will get Brexit or if remain get behind one party that gets a majority they will revoke article 50.Whoever commands parliament will do what they want.

This is why I keep saying that we need to change our political system, get PR to make it fair for parties that get votes but not seats, coalition government to stop radical policies and a direct democracy like Ireland and Switzerland where important matters require referendums. Corbyn would have to put ideas like renationalising water to the people and we decide. The important socialist policies would need our consent. Privatising NHS would need our consent. This is taking back control not leaving the EU and passing control to inept government who don't understand what the public really want. Leaving the EU isn't even half way to that.

[Burgerman]

Yes. The rumanian witches would be represented. And all the other nutters. A ship driven by no-one that has his hands tied. Thats no use as a government. You need someone with a clue in charge, and if he doesent do what he was voted in to do then he should get the boot.

Farage has already changed politics more than anyone has over the last few years. He has made the people aware of what the EU really is and how it works. And that will change everything. Naturally. The EU is already in danger of collapse. The reason its not democratic as you think it is is because nobody elected or can vote on, or remove the commision that makes all the decisions. And as farage says, some days he is basically forced to rubber stamp 250 complex regulations, changes, rules, that he hasnt had time to read. Some are 200 pages thick. So its all rubber stamped. They actually dont make a difference. Only the unelected beurocrats get to have any real say, with their pet EUSSR project. And thats why I voted leave. I want no part of it.

Remember that there was a majority of 1.3+ MILLION that also voted leave. We all knew exactly what leave meant. Its not complicated. You leave! Whats more if the other side had won, do you think we would still be arguing about how hard done to the leave side was, refusing to accept the result, betraying the vote and taking us out regardless, and calling for more erections?

That is why farage is going to destroy all the other parties in the EU voting results tonight. And then join forces with le penn, salvinis party members etc in a rather extreme anti EU group that will bugger up the EU from the inside. The eu leaders are panicking. And trying to keep them out of key EU jobs. The EU is basically done for. So brexit is pretty much

[wheelie junkie]

Parliament needs to represent the people fairly, and one person should never set the direction, would you seriously want 5 years with Corbyn steering? We need long term planning not changing from austerity to a socialist state every 5 years. It needs a team of people with vision to provide direction agreed with the people. Decide whether we want Trident or HS2 not politicians. That is taking control.

You maybe need to look at Farage's attendance record, about the worst attendance of any MEP, our representative on EU fishing policy, attended 1 out of 43 committee meetings. If he spent time doing the job he was paid over €100,000 a year for he might have fitted more in. Lost half his salary for using EU money for UKIP staff. Then his march to London abndoning his 300 supporters after 1 day. A real leader or opportunist politician?

There was a majority of 1.3m from those that voted, that doesn't mean the turnout in a General election will be the same or that people will vote purely on Brexit stance. More than likely leave voters will and they will have a significant advantage. We'll have to wait to see if it means they get the majority needed to get it done It should and finally we will be over it and can get on with our lives again.

It doesn't go far enough for me, I don't want the country run by the politicians that we have and distrust anyone who's ego is big enough to think that they can fix our problems. We've started direct democracy we should continue and see what it brings.

[Burgerman]

Parliament needs to represent the people fairly, and one person should never set the direction, would you seriously want 5 years with Corbyn steering?

If thats what the people vote for. If nothing else it will give a real world history lesson to all there moronic socialist voters. Its cheaper than trying to educate them all in real history or economics.

We need long term planning not changing from austerity to a socialist state every 5 years. It needs a team of people with vision to provide direction agreed with the people. Decide whether we want Trident or HS2 not politicians. That is taking control.

Long term planning by who though. Thats the problem.

You maybe need to look at Farage's attendance record, about the worst attendance of any MEP, our representative on EU fishing policy, attended 1 out of 43 committee meetings. If he spent time doing the job he was paid over €100,000 a year for he might have fitted more in. Lost half his salary for using EU money for UKIP staff.

As he already explained. Rubber stamping piles of papers that are written and decided by the non elected or non removable, is NOT democracy. He wasnt there to do that. He was there to bring about the original referendum, to get us out of the EU. Which he has singularly done. What has he achieved? Exactly what he wanted. And has done more to change both the UK, and the system than any other political figure in 50 years.

There was a majority of 1.3m from those that voted, that doesn't mean the turnout in a General election will be the same

Not voting, is your own choice. Not interested enough to vote? Dont understand it? Then dont vote. It was the highest turnout for any vote ever as it happens.

or that people will vote purely on Brexit stance. More than likely leave voters will and they will have a significant advantage.

1. we already HAD a vote on a single issue. And won.
2. we also already had a vote after this, and 80% of the polulation voted for parties that said they would honour the resullt of that referendum.
3. 80% of parliment voted to trigger articlal 50, and LEAVE on 29th march.

Now all we have is massive resentment that 3 years on they have all done everything possible to IGNORE all of the above and refuse to do as they were voted in to do.

We'll have to wait to see if it means they get the majority needed to get it done It should and finally we will be over it and can get on with our lives again.

As I said. All those remainers in parliment should be sued for damages. And any new prime minister needs to get us out imediately.

It doesn't go far enough for me, I don't want the country run by the politicians that we have and distrust anyone who's ego is big enough to think that they can fix our problems. We've started direct democracy we should continue and see what it brings.

Paralysis and confusion. Thats why we dont want it run by parliment. Unless we have weekly elections to boot each one out if they ignore us. Yet more confusion. What this episode actually shows is that we should be way more informad about who we vote in. And that the moment they go against what we voted them in for, they are fired.

[wheelie junkie]

I'd rather not suffer the consequences of 5 years of Corbyn, it'll take 10+ to recover.

It won't be easy to find people who have vision but they will be out there, possibly from industry but whoever should have a successful track record not years in a university.

Farage didn't need to be an MEP to get change, he wasted our place which could of gone to someone who tried within the EU system. The reality is he failed 7 times to become an MP, PR might of changed that. Not that I would Farage in parliament but in a fair democracy if his party got a reasonable share of votes they should get MP's to represent those voters views.

The problem with any election is parties political statements/manifestos aren't binding, if they don't do what they promise there should be a system to kick them out. There isn't at the moment but that needs to change, accountability. But who has power to change this? The same MP's it'll make accountable.

We have been through the inability of a new PM enough times, try and it ends up in a general election which will be the 3rd attempt at getting Brexit and should result in it happening.

Having to vote on how the country is run might get people more interested/educated/involved and feel part of it instead of it being those clowns in parliament. It works in Ireland and Switzerland so why not here?

Sadly I don't know how to get those changes, MP's won't implement systems that impact upon themselves. That to me is more important than Brexit.

[Burgerman]

Having to vote on how the country is run might get people more interested/educated/involved and feel part of it instead of it being those clowns in parliament. It works in Ireland and Switzerland so why not here?

Because that does not worrk.
Half the country are clueless. They will go because they are forced. And vote for whatever they think. The nicest name. The ARROW on the well thought out logo on the recent EU election...

You want the opposite. You want some qualification questions that ask say 3 questions about politics. Basic stuff. If they get that wrong their vote should go in the bin.

That way only those that understand what they are voting for have a vote that counts.

Note ARROW! (put X here...)

[Burgerman]

Le penn beat macron, and the brexit party has taken everything by storm.

[Burgerman]

Tory party representitive says: They face obliteration for a generation if the dont get us out fast.
Farage says they will do thesame in the ext general election, and more.

[wheelie junkie]

As usual every party bar a couple claiming some form of victory deluded as ever. Every media outlet interpreting the data and forming the conclusion they want. Turnout 37%, so a huge majority who couldn't be bothered to vote. If a general election followed that trend no party would have a big enough majority and a coalition with Brexit party almost certain to be in government which would be strong enough to get us out. If you want a no deal Brexit a general election is still the best way to get it.

We'll have to wait and see what impact it has on the current house but May could use it as an opportunity to bring back her withdrawal bill trying to tempt members against a no deal into us exiting with some kind of deal.

Having to vote on how the country is run might get people more interested/educated/involved and feel part of it instead of it being those clowns in parliament. It works in Ireland and Switzerland so why not here?

Because that does not worrk.
Half the country are clueless. They will go because they are forced. And vote for whatever they think. The nicest name. The ARROW on the well thought out logo on the recent EU election...

You want the opposite. You want some qualification questions that ask say 3 questions about politics. Basic stuff. If they get that wrong their vote should go in the bin.

That way only those that understand what they are voting for have a vote that counts.

Note ARROW! (put X here...)

Include basic politics and economics in our education system and over time people will be educated. I've got no problem with answering questions to demonstrate understanding of the subject but some votes wouldn't need eg the divorce referendum in Ireland recently. It has to be better than leaving it to MP's who have their own agendas and some getting paid to get changes through. Too many snouts in the trough.

[Burgerman]

Include basic politics and economics in our education system and over time people will be educated.

We do that now. The EDU establishments have been infiltrated with the left. It turns out endless students on both sides of the pond with a hatred ofthe very thing that makes rich western countries rich. Capitalism, free trade etc. And a sanitised excuse ridden version of history that tries to explain in endlessely complex ways why every single place that tried socialist economics, planned economies, either went bust like venuzuala, collapsed completely, or is still clinging on and poor. So be careful what you wish for. That education turns out marxist loving lefties that are progressives, liberals, and who still thing theres some magic money tree and everyone should get free everything with open borders. And that capitalism is bad/greedy. It turns out the perfect political education to bankrupt the rich western countries.

The BBC staff are 90% this way. Champagne socialists that are living a decadant lifestyle based on the capitalist free trade economy. While pushing the liberal, left, and denigrating anyone that says or thinks differently. And the same with most media. And polititicians. Hence the brexit issue. Be careful what you wish for.

[wheelie junkie]

Educate them to be able to understand how to make informed decisions looking at all aspects of the subject. An hour where they have to argue one side of a subject for 30 minutes then swap and argue the other. The problem now is that social media dominates not the BBC and I see so many shared untrue posts coming from the same people who have been targeted and used because they share. I'm more concerned on that than any BBC bias.

[Burgerman]

I asked a door knocking labour candidate which socialist country he would prefer to live in. Blank expression.
I asked him which socialist economic one (place to live) was a good example of sociaalism? Again. Blank look.
I asked what he thought the reason for the economic collapse happening in venuzuala as we were speaking. 100 excuses. but not the real one... That never got a mention.

UIts a waste of time. they *know* socialism, is the way. But they cant tell you why it has always failed every last time. Always it was done wrong...

[wheelie junkie]

Slightly different if you ask about social democracy which many don't realise isn't socialism but can work.

[Burgerman]

countless captains? I dont think so.

We just need me in charge.

[wheelie junkie]

countless captains? I dont think so.

We just need me in charge.

The really good bit about our democracy is that you can stand for parliament and represent your local constituency, the downside you don't get to be in charge unless you belong to one of the big parties. Join the Brexit party and put forward that you will stand and you never know, it could happen.

[Burgerman]

No I mean JUST ME. As in I want to be a dictator. sO i DONT HAVE TO SUFFER ALL THE IDIOTS. dAMN This keyboard.

[Lord Chatterley]

I asked a door knocking labour candidate which socialist country he would prefer to live in. Blank expression.
I asked him which socialist economic one (place to live) was a good example of sociaalism? Again. Blank look.
I asked what he thought the reason for the economic collapse happening in venuzuala as we were speaking. 100 excuses. but not the real one... That never got a mention.

UIts a waste of time. they *know* socialism, is the way. But they cant tell you why it has always failed every last time. Always it was done wrong...

People vote for socialism because they think it's moral.

LC

[Burgerman]

Socialism has killed, starved, and made the lives of millions a mysery with no escape and endless lack of freedom for half a century or so across half the world. How is it moral? Yes they dont teach reality in the modern school system. But they do teach that capitalism is greed and thats all bad. Which is completely reversed.

And the planned economy countries are the poorest. And the free trade and naturally self controlled free market countries are the richest.