what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

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what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 15 Jan 2021, 07:06

HI everyone,
I took a long look at burgerman's mb2 pictures with LARGE tIRES.

Atmoment, i use a 646 se quicky back wheelpowered wheelchair with 14x3 3.00 -8 powertracks tires. it is almost ok to drive in streets and going over small barrage of snow but sincerely i search for better solution and putting chain is not an option since it breaks indoor floors..

When you look at the tire wide of bm2 picture you could think it should manage better but things can be deceptive for example, on a bicycle , i used to much prefer riding with thin tire with nails rather that a fat bike lage tire since thin tires cut throug snow and in the end it works better .

You really it has to be tested it that is my conclusion.
So i guess my question ONLY IS ADDRESSED TO PEOPLE HAVING TRIED BOTH REGULAR primo track and large tires . Which on works best.

I do NOT drive on winter cross country skiing tracks not fluffy untouched virgin winter track in nature, i just drive on winter sidewalk and most of the time i end up driving my wheelchair in the street cause there is less snow but there are often 2feet wide by one feet high snow barrage left by the snow plows

i did put picture of the kind of snow barrage i have to go through regularly so the tire questions is clearer on the conditions but what i have to cross is a little bigger
Image

Image

Image



Image

Image


tx see y0u
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 15 Jan 2021, 12:47

Well the two tyres I use in the picture above on my BM2/3 chairs work much better in snow than the narrow 3.00 tyres do. And sand. But you cannot fit those to a stock chair as it will be much too wide. The chair was designed to be narrow so the wider tyres end up at the same width as a stockchair.

On ice they are both useless.

On soft ground in winter any wider tyre helps. I have 120/70-8 low profile tyres on the Salsa, and the Q700R chairs.

I dont do much snow but soft ground/heavy chair needs more tyre width. So my "normal" over the counter lightly modded chairs, such as the Salsa, viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7455&start=600#p122818 (read the first post CAREFULLY since you are looking for a new rear drive chair). This is a sunrise chair 4 years ago now.

And the newer Sunrise Q700R chair I recently bought also has 120/70-8 tyres. Its tech parameters are almost identical to the salsa. Which is why I suggested reading that well. And applying it to any new chair that is rear drive.
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 15 Jan 2021, 12:48

Well the two tyres I use in the picture above on my BM2/3 chairs work much better in snow than the narrow 3.00 tyres do. And sand. But you cannot fit those to a stock chair as it will be much too wide. The chair was designed to be narrow so the wider tyres end up at the same width as a stockchair.

On ice they are both useless.

On soft ground in winter any wider tyre helps. I have 120/70-8 low profile tyres on the Salsa, and the Q700R chairs. They are no good on snow. They use a very slick type tread. Works OK on sand etc.

I dont do much snow but soft ground/heavy chair needs more tyre width. Think styletto heel... You dont want that as you get sunk and stuck. So my "normal" over the counter lightly modded chairs, such as the Salsa, viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7455&start=600#p122818 (read the first post CAREFULLY since you are looking for a new rear drive chair). This is a sunrise chair 4 years ago now.

And the newer Sunrise Q700R chair I recently bought also has 120/70-8 tyres. Its tech parameters are almost identical to the salsa. Which is why I suggested reading that well. And applying it to any new chair that is rear drive.

While looking for rear drive chairs also look at viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9873
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby LROBBINS » 15 Jan 2021, 13:22

If you do change rims and can tolerate wider tires and larger overall width you might also take a look at tires designed for snow blowers. Here's a few from the Carlisle catalog (they have others as well).
SnowHog.jpg
The 4.80-8 may be a good compromise width and alloy 3.5" tubeless rims are available from AliExpress at good prices. You would need to an adapter to fit those rims to the motors. This is a very aggressive, blocky tread and you might want to swap for a smoother tire when the snow's gone, unless you like the massage effect they'd have on dry pavement.
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 16 Jan 2021, 17:35

i have the same chair - i am using 350-8 tires on the stock rims - you have to do nothing to make it fit and work - only maybe lift the fender up a bit - they are a bit taller OD

this would fit and work - i never used these - i would bet they are better than the stock tires -

https://www.jpcycles.com/product/29966/ ... jIQAvD_BwE


https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/shi ... WQQAvD_BwE

i use the same size but mines are street tires -
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby duke1 » 16 Jan 2021, 17:57

hi these fit good on the 3x8 rims and i like that they protrude a little past the rim so if you hit anything it just bounces of and the extra little width is not a problem unless mudguards are real close to tyre and they are long lasting grip pretty well and hard to puncture do not rot and are not grey!
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-x-Michelin ... 2012300552
ive had them on my tinas gunter chair for 2 years and 6-10 miles a day had zero punctures and still more than half the tread left,better than cheng shins. good luck :D :joint
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 16 Jan 2021, 22:06

download/file.php?id=14782&mode=view

If that dog is real its a throwback to the punk era. Does it hafe safety pins etc too?
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 16 Jan 2021, 22:07

its real - not my dog - my friend Quickie -
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 16 Jan 2021, 22:13

You freind is named after a wheelchair too? :problem:
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 16 Jan 2021, 22:33

thats her name here - i believe - she has a quickie chair also and 200ah in there
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 16 Jan 2021, 22:34

Excellent!
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 17 Jan 2021, 01:00

the only person i managed to switch over - i would have though i would have at least half dozen users on lithium

i was wrong - oh well - she will be happy - as for me - shit - i am still running a 105ah pack going on 6 years this summer

i noticed the graphs from the last time i used it in the summer - was great - now that its been sitting - since sept. used it a few times here and there -

the last charge few days ago - not as good - it shows how when you do use it daily or often enough and charge - they are good tight balance fine -

i was expecting the graphs to be off - after all besides being used hard when i do use it - Age itself - i havnt opened that battery box on that chair in 5 years - dont plan too either - :thumbup:
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 17 Jan 2021, 01:04

it was my very first large pack in a chair - i used bare copper rings - not good choice i know now - but i though copper was best back then

wiring could have been thicker also - at least i have the power wires with 8awg - i used 10 and 12 on some things - i didnt feel i was able to fit larger - now i know i could - either way - its been working fine since -

not complaining - even if it went bad tomorrow - was worth it for me to do -
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 17 Jan 2021, 03:13

When you compare to the never ending lead battery deterioration and replacement it seems unreal thet they just keep going doesent it. Your BMS equiped bounder wont last as well. Even though its getting an easier life than the addon.
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 17 Jan 2021, 05:22

the bounder will last enough because i have an ADD ON also -- on its own - it wont last - when it dies and if its not covered by insurance

then i can make a 200ah one and no BMS - till then - so far so good - at least on the surface
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby ex-Gooserider » 19 Jan 2021, 03:32

Burgerman wrote:http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/board/download/file.php?id=14782&mode=view

If that dog is real its a throwback to the punk era. Does it hafe safety pins etc too?


With those eyes, I was wondering more if it needed to be exorcised instead of just walked.... :P :lol: If it starts barfing split pea soup I'd be VERY worried.....

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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 21 Jan 2021, 13:27

expresso wrote:i have the same chair - i am using 350-8 tires on the stock rims - you have to do nothing to make it fit and work - only maybe lift the fender up a bit - they are a bit taller OD

this would fit and work - i never used these - i would bet they are better than the stock tires -

https://www.jpcycles.com/product/29966/ ... jIQAvD_BwE


https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/shi ... WQQAvD_BwE

i use the same size but mines are street tires -

hi the black tire where your dog is surely is not good for snow. But the tires that i see when i click the link, the 421 do have decent squace for traction. i like them. Are you sure and certain that they will fit my chaire if i remove the fender? with the same original rim?

it could be a great improvement
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 21 Jan 2021, 14:11

Every chair is different. Even the same brand/model changes according to prescription form options.

STOCK 3.00 x 8 tyres are Three inches wide, and 3 inches tall (sidewall)
So a 3.50 x 8 tyre is half an inch wider in total overall width. That means its 1/4" wider on the outside. And on the inside. And will be 1/2 inch taller on the bottom, and on the top... So take a look at your chair/tyre and look at the gap.

So you may or may not need to move the mudguard/fender up (or take it off). Look at the gaps. Is there room for 1/2' ich or 12.4mm taller?? And look at the gap on your stock tyre, on the inside between any parts like the motor casing. Is there 1/4" or 6mm gap now? If the answer is yes,in both cases it will fit no problem.

Although be careful as tyres are sized approximately. They call it nominal sizing. So this may be 2 to 3mm out.
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 21 Jan 2021, 17:34

yeshelp wrote:
expresso wrote:i have the same chair - i am using 350-8 tires on the stock rims - you have to do nothing to make it fit and work - only maybe lift the fender up a bit - they are a bit taller OD

this would fit and work - i never used these - i would bet they are better than the stock tires -

https://www.jpcycles.com/product/29966/ ... jIQAvD_BwE


https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/shi ... WQQAvD_BwE


those black tires with the dog - those are what i have on my chair - same chair 646se - 350-8 size tire using the stock rim - it fits perfect for me only had to raise the fender - i cant say 100% how the snow tire knobby one i posted a link to will fit on your chair - but the the size is the same 350-8 - it should fit your rim the same way mines did - then you have to see if you need to raise the fender or not and also how close to your chair frame - if it hits - you can add an washer to the wheel - i didnt have to do nothing but raise the fender -

i use the same size but mines are street tires -

hi the black tire where your dog is surely is not good for snow. But the tires that i see when i click the link, the 421 do have decent squace for traction. i like them. Are you sure and certain that they will fit my chaire if i remove the fender? with the same original rim?

it could be a great improvement
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 23 Jan 2021, 13:16

Burgerman wrote:Well the two tyres I use in the picture above on my BM2/3 chairs work much better in snow than the narrow 3.00 tyres do. And sand. But you cannot fit those to a stock chair as it will be much too wide. The chair was designed to be narrow so the wider tyres end up at the same width as a stockchair.

On ice they are both useless.

On soft ground in winter any wider tyre helps. I have 120/70-8 low profile tyres on the Salsa, and the Q700R chairs.

I dont do much snow but soft ground/heavy chair needs more tyre width. So my "normal" over the counter lightly modded chairs, such as the Salsa, viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7455&start=600#p122818 (read the first post CAREFULLY since you are looking for a new rear drive chair). This is a sunrise chair 4 years ago now.

And the newer Sunrise Q700R chair I recently bought also has 120/70-8 tyres. Its tech parameters are almost identical to the salsa. Which is why I suggested reading that well. And applying it to any new chair that is rear drive.


HI i dont have the money for a new machine.. i do wonder how tires large like yours do in city with big winter like quebec. would you know someone that lives at that latitude and has your tires width?
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 23 Jan 2021, 13:22

Burgerman wrote:Well the two tyres I use in the picture above on my BM2/3 chairs work much better in snow than the narrow 3.00 tyres do. And sand. But you cannot fit those to a stock chair as it will be much too wide. The chair was designed to be narrow so the wider tyres end up at the same width as a .

for now i dont think about where it would fit, i m trying to see if it works better in first place. when you say yours work better in snow could you describe me what condition you talk about cause

with 2 inch of snow the primotrax are ok
but when i have a barrage to cross i get jacked and wheels turn in the air kind of.
i do zero forest driving or offroad in winter.

tx
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 23 Jan 2021, 13:42

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/gopro/snow3.mp4

We dont get enough snow in the last decade to test! But being wider they dont sink in soft stuff. And they grip well. Even on stuff thats 4 or 5 inches thick or when frozen. The biggest difference is that my casters are bigger, and the CG is very rearwards too So Almost all of the chairs weight is on the drive wheels. Both are always in good ground contact. So no spin. No getting stuck. Its more than just tyres. Please ignore the bent footplate. I crashed the day before into a traffic cone and ran over it. They are heavier than they look!
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 06 Dec 2021, 05:12

Burgerman wrote:Every chair is different. Even the same brand/model changes according to prescription form options.

STOCK 3.00 x 8 tyres are Three inches wide, and 3 inches tall (sidewall)
So a 3.50 x 8 tyre is half an inch wider in total overall width. That means its 1/4" wider on the outside. And on the inside. And will be 1/2 inch taller on the bottom, and on the top... So take a look at your chair/tyre and look at the gap.

So you may or may not need to move the mudguard/fender up (or take it off). Look at the gaps. Is there room for 1/2' ich or 12.4mm taller?? And look at the gap on your stock tyre, on the inside between any parts like the motor casing. Is there 1/4" or 6mm gap now? If the answer is yes,in both cases it will fit no problem.

Although be careful as tyres are sized approximately. They call it nominal sizing. So this may be 2 to 3mm out.


hi Burgerman, Snow has arrived where i live and in some days there will be increasing amouts 10 cm 30 cm now and then.
i take this post alive again.

im about to buy the Shinko 421 Series Mini Bike Trail Motorcycle Tires 3.50 -8. here
https://www.jpcycles.com/product/29966/ ... rd=DR10991

do you think it will fit my 646 se these pict have stoc 3.00 8 primo powertracks tire? here are picture i took
here there is 2.4 cm loose to the fender https://imgur.com/Gp1RIUM

here what should i mesure? between what and what
? https://imgur.com/6QCYrYE

Also do i need to add some sort of glue gel grease between the rim metal and the tire?

tx for you wise advise and if you find tires that could fit my wheelchair that are more agressive like have very deep crampon that could be nice to see .
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby swalker » 06 Dec 2021, 06:03

I live where it snows a lot. The average in town is around 180 inches per year, but where I live, we often receive 300 inches.

I have found that the best tires for my Permobil 14 inch drive tires (3.00x8) are the Permobil Mud and Snow tires. They have a bit of tackiness to them that really helps them stick in snow and, to some degree, on ice.

In the US, these can only be purchased from a Durable Medical Equipment (DME) provider. I am in the process of obtaining a pair from NuMotion to replace the worn out tires on my Permobil C500.

These tires wear quickly when driven on bare asphalt. As little as 100 miles of driving on bare asphalt is sufficient to wear them out. Yet, they will go close to 1,000 miles on snow and ice.

They cost me about $100 per pair of tires, though the DME wants to sell the tire and wheel assembly for close to $1,000.

Steve
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby Burgerman » 06 Dec 2021, 06:11

The 3.50 x 8 tyres will fit, but are 1/4 inch wider each side. So depending on motor/frame and tyre gap you might need some 3 to 6mm spacers or washers.
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 06 Dec 2021, 06:16

i have the same chair - my 350-8 fit just enough - i didnt have to do anything other than raise my fender

i dont have the same tire you are looking at - so it can be different - mines are smooth tires but dont see why those wont fit -

at the very worse - add the washer - but you may be fine with just the fender raised

i like to hear how they feel to you - at first i was going to try those also - but since its mostly road here - i went with the slick looking smooth tire
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 07 Dec 2021, 03:46

expresso wrote:i have the same chair - my 350-8 fit just enough - i didnt have to do anything other than raise my fender

i dont have the same tire you are looking at - so it can be different - mines are smooth tires but dont see why those wont fit -

at the very worse - add the washer - but you may be fine with just the fender raised

i like to hear how they feel to you - at first i was going to try those also - but since its mostly road here - i went with the slick looking smooth tire


hi yeah sure i can tell you my impression on them once i will i ridden them. would you have some picture or a tutorial on how to raise the fender? i dont know how to do that . in fact i thought i would have to take take them off or saw cut them off. You are saiying it is possible to raise them without dammaging them?
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 07 Dec 2021, 03:50

swalker wrote:I live where it snows a lot. The average in town is around 180 inches per year, but where I live, we often receive 300 inches.

I have found that the best tires for my Permobil 14 inch drive tires (3.00x8) are the Permobil Mud and Snow tires. They have a bit of tackiness to them that really helps them stick in snow and, to some degree, on ice.

In the US, these can only be purchased from a Durable Medical Equipment (DME) provider. I am in the process of obtaining a pair from NuMotion to replace the worn out tires on my Permobil C500.

These tires wear quickly when driven on bare asphalt. As little as 100 miles of driving on bare asphalt is sufficient to wear them out. Yet, they will go close to 1,000 miles on snow and ice.

They cost me about $100 per pair of tires, though the DME wants to sell the tire and wheel assembly for close to $1,000.

Steve

hi walker would you have a link to the product ? i didnt find it even in the google image. DME is it a cie compagny? tx
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby yeshelp » 07 Dec 2021, 03:55

Burgerman wrote:The 3.50 x 8 tyres will fit, but are 1/4 inch wider each side. So depending on motor/frame and tyre gap you might need some 3 to 6mm spacers or washers.

Hi Burger, can i call you burger for some reason i find that to be a very funny name to use hahaha

the spacers you talk about would have to be inserted between the metal wheell and the frame part where the screws come from correct?
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Re: what are the best tires for driving in canada s winter

Postby expresso » 07 Dec 2021, 04:01

when you remove the wheel - you will have two screws holding down that fender - you be able to see them

you need to add a spacer and longer bolts - all depends how much you need to raise it - i dont now what size bolt or spacer was used - since it was done for me - i didnt do it myself

but in my case it was enough to clear the larger tire - i am pretty sure your tires will be larger than the stock tire you have now -

https://www.quickie-wheelchairs.com/rep ... 646-s646se
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