New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k change!

Power wheelchair board for REAL info!

POWERCHAIR MENU! www.wheelchairdriver.com/powerchair-stuff.htm

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 24 Jan 2021, 13:57

Well mine is high because to get proper control, requires that your hand can sit along the side of the joystick pod as a reference position, and only thumb and forefinger control the joystick. Any other way means that you cannot do that. Which means you also cant use proper linear proporional programming and you end up with the sort of stock hovercraft steering of all stock powerchairs. The two things go together.

Unless you are refering to the size of the joystick pod/screen. And I agree. However when you have a bunch of seating functions, and other stuff this new screen is way brighter. You can see it clearly outdoors, and it helps enormously to see what mode/speed/seating function etc that you are cycling through and selecting. So again, its a compromise. Desks? Not sure why its an issue. It bugs me when I am working on things as it gets in the way. Even when the swingaway is used. I had to stiffen that up too!

What bugs me worse is that the Ctrl+5 thingy is on the opposite side. And whatever is on my knee inevitably hits the buttons and starts moving the seat around...
Also the STOCK position leaves it stuck out proud of the arm top making the chair wide, and ready to be wiped out at speed every time you get close to a gatepost or doorway or whatever. Since they charge 700 UK or 1200 US for these things I suspect that its a get rich quick scheme!

I am still in two minds. I already removed one from a sunrise chair belonging to a freind years ago as it was endlessely getting in his way and was broken. That got thrown out recently. And another 4 button one from a permobil also not working... Those are weird. No R-Net bus connector, permobil only thing so also binned. Again not mine. So I have modded the mounting on the Q700R, to move it inboard so its no longer sticking out. Its still a nusance. I can do everything with the joystick. So I am still in two minds as to if I will keep it or not.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Swan T.W. » 24 Jan 2021, 21:54

Burgerman wrote:Well mine is high because to get proper control, requires that your hand can sit along the side of the joystick pod as a reference position, and only thumb and forefinger control the joystick. Any other way means that you cannot do that. Which means you also cant use proper linear proporional programming and you end up with the sort of stock hovercraft steering of all stock powerchairs. The two things go together.

Unless you are refering to the size of the joystick pod/screen. And I agree. However when you have a bunch of seating functions, and other stuff this new screen is way brighter. You can see it clearly outdoors, and it helps enormously to see what mode/speed/seating function etc that you are cycling through and selecting. So again, its a compromise. Desks? Not sure why its an issue. It bugs me when I am working on things as it gets in the way. Even when the swingaway is used. I had to stiffen that up too!

What bugs me worse is that the Ctrl+5 thingy is on the opposite side. And whatever is on my knee inevitably hits the buttons and starts moving the seat around...
Also the STOCK position leaves it stuck out proud of the arm top making the chair wide, and ready to be wiped out at speed every time you get close to a gatepost or doorway or whatever. Since they charge 700 UK or 1200 US for these things I suspect that its a get rich quick scheme!

I am still in two minds. I already removed one from a sunrise chair belonging to a freind years ago as it was endlessely getting in his way and was broken. That got thrown out recently. And another 4 button one from a permobil also not working... Those are weird. No R-Net bus connector, permobil only thing so also binned. Again not mine. So I have modded the mounting on the Q700R, to move it inboard so its no longer sticking out. Its still a nusance. I can do everything with the joystick. So I am still in two minds as to if I will keep it or not.

Velcro the Ctrl-5 switch under the armrest or some other out of the way place. Then if you need it on your lap when you are tilted or reclined just pull it off.
Swan T.W.
 
Posts: 267
Joined: 20 Jan 2010, 17:03
Location: Ontario,Canada

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 24 Jan 2021, 22:44

Not a bad plan. But its where. And by the time I unvelcro it and move it I could have used the joystick. What would have been better is to have the "direct" buttons built into the joystick. Rather than using the modes button.

If I remove it, and leave the mount. I get a perfect solid descrete DSLR camera mount! :problem:

I may make a movie.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 24 Jan 2021, 22:51

Even if swung out and back? Gets nowhere near anything at my desk. There are small joysticks. And ones with no display. Or small displays. But if you have many seating options etc its hard to see where you are in the menu. So theres always options. Like everything its a compromise.

Theres an r-net mini joystick. And theres another here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10245
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby rover220 » 25 Jan 2021, 10:00

Burgerman wrote:Not a bad plan. But its where. And by the time I unvelcro it and move it I could have used the joystick. What would have been better is to have the "direct" buttons built into the joystick. Rather than using the modes button.



you can, its called assignable buttons. have a play.
rover220
 
Posts: 1505
Joined: 10 Dec 2013, 19:34
Location: West Mids, UK

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Frank » 25 Jan 2021, 11:00

How do assignable buttons work?
Frank
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 11:17
Location: Malta

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jan 2021, 12:36

In the PC software you tell the system what you want each button to do. Can be many things. On the advanced colour joystick at least. They can have press and hold 2nd functions. Dont use the hazards? Theres two assignable functions there. On press. And press and hold. Or just press... And you can asign the 5 switch unit to do whatever you want as well.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Frank » 25 Jan 2021, 13:49

Thank you for the useful information. Through programming can one make a delay to the brakes?
Frank
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 11:17
Location: Malta

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jan 2021, 14:34

Depends what you mean by brakes. A powerchair doesent really have brakes in the sense a bicycle or a car does. You have on/off locks that work like a handbrake. They come on (by chopping off the power to them) like a vehicles hand brake only once the chair is stopped. They release as soon as you want to move. If you were to delay when they come on after you stop then you will roll down slopes into the road for e.g.

You can set in programming many things though. Such as deceleration. So the chair slows down either very agressively as you release the stick. Or hardly at all and rolls on which is how mine is.I have back stick braking set to slow the chair down pretty much instantly on pulling the stick back beyond the centre. This is all easy to configure.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Frank » 25 Jan 2021, 15:30

I mean delay of the brakes on the motors. This can be useful for indoor use to avoid a lot of clicking noise.
Attachments
Capture.JPG
Frank
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 11:17
Location: Malta

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby rover220 » 25 Jan 2021, 18:52

Frank wrote:I mean delay of the brakes on the motors. This can be useful for indoor use to avoid a lot of clicking noise.


less useful on a steep hill outside
rover220
 
Posts: 1505
Joined: 10 Dec 2013, 19:34
Location: West Mids, UK

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Swan T.W. » 25 Jan 2021, 19:25

Burgerman wrote:Not a bad plan. But its where. And by the time I unvelcro it and move it I could have used the joystick. What would have been better is to have the "direct" buttons built into the joystick. Rather than using the modes button.

If I remove it, and leave the mount. I get a perfect solid descrete DSLR camera mount! :problem:

I may make a movie.

Some can't reach the joystick when reclined.
Swan T.W.
 
Posts: 267
Joined: 20 Jan 2010, 17:03
Location: Ontario,Canada

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby rover220 » 25 Jan 2021, 20:24

Swan T.W. wrote:
Burgerman wrote:Not a bad plan. But its where. And by the time I unvelcro it and move it I could have used the joystick. What would have been better is to have the "direct" buttons built into the joystick. Rather than using the modes button.

If I remove it, and leave the mount. I get a perfect solid descrete DSLR camera mount! :problem:

I may make a movie.

Some can't reach the joystick when reclined.


This is why chairs have many many options that not every one understands. Manufacturers don't make just one chair for a reason.
rover220
 
Posts: 1505
Joined: 10 Dec 2013, 19:34
Location: West Mids, UK

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Swan T.W. » 25 Jan 2021, 21:20

rover220 wrote:
Swan T.W. wrote:
Burgerman wrote:Not a bad plan. But its where. And by the time I unvelcro it and move it I could have used the joystick. What would have been better is to have the "direct" buttons built into the joystick. Rather than using the modes button.

If I remove it, and leave the mount. I get a perfect solid descrete DSLR camera mount! :problem:

I may make a movie.

Some can't reach the joystick when reclined.


This is why chairs have many many options that not every one understands. Manufacturers don't make just one chair for a reason.

Especially DMEs and most manufacturers REPs. In thirty plus years I've met one REP and one and a half DMEs who were knowledgeable and competent..
Swan T.W.
 
Posts: 267
Joined: 20 Jan 2010, 17:03
Location: Ontario,Canada

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jan 2021, 22:58

Sound pretty much like what I found. Its a hopeless situation for most end users who live with badly configured and badly programmed chairs all their lives and they think its THEM that has to get used to a new chair! It shouldnt be this way.

Once properly set up and configured and programmed almost every chair feels pretty much identical. Because once your seating and controls are positioned the same - across all your chairs - and the programming is the same, theres really almost no FEEL difference. They just feel alike. And perform alike. Some are a bit more top heavy, some are a bit wider. In use they all drive pretty much the same once configured. If it doesent it needs sorting out! Many small adjustments - I usually take a ruler to everything. My Q700R chair is still being fine tuned. I just moved the CTRL+5 box's mount inboard half an inch and back so there only a small gap to the arm end. It took a hacksaw and drill/tap 2 holes. But now its right! And I chopped off all the hanging uneeded metalwork from its mountings. No longer looks like it was bolted on in the wrong place with scafolding as an afterthought. I still dont like it...

Like wise. Wobbly arms. Had to go. Scroll up. £210 to add 2 extra uprights. Took a bit lateral thinking and cutting, and fidling around, now they dont wobble - just like my other chairs and are in the exact same position. Width, for/back, and joystick position. And thats been stiffened up too. Those swingaways are a discrace! Many small fixes. Also seat dump angles, CG position, Leg angle and length. Backrest angle, height, and so on.

Theres a few - rover on here for e.g, that get it and are good. But most are like totally clueless. And worse! The ones that claim to know everything and cause more damage and chisel marks as they prove that they dont. But even the likes of rover cannot afford to spend a week with drills, taps, programmers, adding extra or modded parts, because of cost. Its just not practical. That leaves sites like this and DIY or find a helper that can listen!
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby expresso » 25 Jan 2021, 23:06

dont worry now you can just add a LUCI to your chair - it will do it for you - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywqmQgWUQlE

it may be useless to some users -
Quickie P222se - 60Ah ADD ON
Quickie S646se - 150Ah LifePo4
Quickie 636 - 200ah LifePo4
Bounder Plus - 180Ah LifePo4
expresso
 
Posts: 9915
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jan 2021, 23:16

Dont know what it is or why I would want one? :problem:

Seems like its trying to make up for the typical chair thats programmed in pudding stir mode? What happens for e.g when I want to crash through my bedroom door which opens both ways with sprung hinges 20 times a day? Or I WANT to drive off a curb as I do dozens of times a day. And 101 other scenarios? Its just not a thing most of us would want never mind need. I can see some extreme cases where it could help. With alterative controls for e.g.

What would be more helpful to most to stop them crashing into walls in that coridor would be if they programmed the damned chair to go where you tell it. I could go though that at full speed with confidence. After sorting out the programming. All of it in fact.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby expresso » 25 Jan 2021, 23:20

its a bunch of senors - with the cloud and app based on phone - for some users - it may be helpful - prevent an accident off a curb or sudden movement etc, or riding down a narrow hall with a shaky hand - can keep you from hitting the walls etc,
Quickie P222se - 60Ah ADD ON
Quickie S646se - 150Ah LifePo4
Quickie 636 - 200ah LifePo4
Bounder Plus - 180Ah LifePo4
expresso
 
Posts: 9915
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby ex-Gooserider » 26 Jan 2021, 01:49

Looks nice...

Rather than anodizing the silver arms, have you looked at powder coating? Might be less... Or take them to your local autobody shop and get them hit w/ 2-pack paint.... Or there is always the 'instant anodizing pen' - better known as a "Sharpie" :lol:

One question about the smaller casters and bigger rear tires - it looks like this has made the caster barrels have a bit of a rearwards tilt... Is this going to cause a problem? In general how big of a concern is a few degrees of tilt forwards or backwards in the caster barrels? I know the ideal is vertical, but is less than say 5* likely to be a problem?

ex-Gooserider
T-5, ASIA-B
Jazzy 1100
Jazzy Select 6
Quickie Q-7
Invacare Mariner
Want to make / get a better chair, ideally one that stands.
User avatar
ex-Gooserider
 
Posts: 5565
Joined: 15 Feb 2011, 06:17
Location: Billerica, MA. USA

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 27 Jan 2021, 16:57

Its hard to see. Maybe 1.5 to 2 degrees? Cant tell at all when in use just drives normally. Dont think its very critical. Doesent stay at 0 degrees anyway its front suspension moves around.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Frank » 01 Feb 2021, 17:46

Are pushing handles needed?
Frank
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 11:17
Location: Malta

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 01 Feb 2021, 19:34

Well that depends on you. Do you use them? Generally I cut them off if they have them as part of the seat frame or shorten them considerably. Are they useful? Only if you need to push the chair, or have an assistant with a 2nd joystick at the rear.

For my purposes they are just a damned nusance that breaks things and hooks up on stuff as you try to turn in tight places like toilets etc. So much better gone! Dragged my PC over onto its side once as I turned. Broke a mirror in a public bathroom as I turned in a close spot.

They are an option on the Q700 chairs prescription form, or an extra (that costs extra) and are ommited on a stock chair by default. Which I think is good.

******
They are built into my other Salsa chair and many other makes of chairs. On the salsa I just sawed off 7 inches and threw in the bin. Leaving just 1 inch so it cannot dig into my back. And put a rubber cap on it to finish it off. EBay...
I also made my own way smaller neater headrest mount. It sticks out behind 7 inches less. Which allowed me to removed a load of uneeded scaffolding from the rear.

See salsa modded and shortened, new DIY headrest mount:
810_2349.JPG


As well as the headrest/scaffolding and push handle mods, you can see where I have moved the front lights inboard from the frame, to the seating mount on this shot too. Why? Because when you are manoevering next to stuff to transfer or work on stuff they get wiped out! EVERY inch gained or every bit that sticks out matters to me. It makes a better chair that doesent get damaged or damage your surroundings. You can DO more.

The Salsa is discontinued. But many of the things I did, such as black tyres, inboard lights, no push handles, a centre footplate option, and a better headrest mount have all been implemented already in the Q700R. Seems they are learning. Around 20 years late. But still some errors! And no lithium.
Errors? Casters too close together, less substantial lift/tilt module, weaker arms. But it can be overcome easily.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby greybeard » 02 Feb 2021, 17:32

Hi BM,
I'm having problems getting the adjustment of the centre power footplates right on my WCS Q500. I recall you mentioned that for various reasons you also prefer to drive with no tilt. Have you found a way of doing so on the Q700 without the footplate bracket or the bottom of the chrome tube hitting the ground? Ideally I would like the seat bottomed out and almost parallel to the ground but to do that the footplates need to be sticking out the front farther than I would like. Am I missing an adjustment somewhere I haven't noticed?
greybeard
 
Posts: 946
Joined: 28 Aug 2014, 20:15
Location: Dorset, UK

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 02 Feb 2021, 17:58

I havent looked at a Q500R other than in pictures.

Can you send a GOOD CLEAR bunch of photos?

Seat angle. Do you want any seat dump when its at its lowest tilt angle? I like mine around 5 to 6 degrees. So I lowered the tilt completely, and added the seat dump I needed by undoing the 4 bolts that hold the seat on and adding 4 spacers. 2 very short ones and 2 whatever length you need to get the angle you prefer. Is that what you mean?

Did you remove the tyre guard/fenders and fit the smaller 8 inch front tyres?
If you do then everything should work much better than the swingaway ones. If your seat cushion and seat length adjustment is like mine 20 inches. If its shorter you mah need to move the seat forwards from the rearmost position.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 02 Feb 2021, 17:59

What chrome tube??

Look closely at this.
Seat is at the rearmost position, 4.5 inch thick cushion.
Footplate angle and height, and seat dump angle is exactly how I drive it.
Seat tilt angle is shown at it most downward position. And seat lift at its lowest. Footrest angle is correct and doesent touch tyres at any position. Theres at least 4.5 inches ground clearance on lowest point of footrest, maybe 5 inches. I am 5' 10".

download/file.php?id=14813&mode=view

If you need greater seat height, you can raise the mounting at both ends on the seat tilt/lift module. All this stuff should be done for you by WCS...
Attachments
Q700R-MODS.jpg
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 02 Feb 2021, 18:12

When adjusting footrest, lift the footplate length electrically so its short as it goes. Then mechanically lower the footplates themselves. Two bolts each side. To match your legs at this shortest position. So at its shortest setting it is in the correct length position when seated normally. Then nothing should stick down below your heels. No chrome tube!
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby greybeard » 03 Feb 2021, 02:50

That last post sounds like the adjustment advice I needed. I'll have another bash at it in the morning. The WCS were great as far as giving me the chair with all the toys I needed but were not so hot on setting it up. It didn't really drive that badly but I insisted they tried to program it. The "tech" they sent had never heard of OBP and barely knew how to use his OEM programmer so I showed him how to enable OBP and set all the turn accelerators/decelerators to 100%. I didn't want to push my luck so I later borrowed an OEM programmer and set the rest up for myself.

Happily I found the speed limited to 80%. That extra 20% has given me another one mile an hour. 5mph doesn't feel that different to 6! :dance The footrest was the only setup issue that was unresolved. Thanks for your help, yet again.

Incidentally this is my first experience with Jay cushion with a gel insert. I'm finding it a little sweaty and suspect it will be worse when it turns warmer. Any tips please?
greybeard
 
Posts: 946
Joined: 28 Aug 2014, 20:15
Location: Dorset, UK

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 03 Feb 2021, 03:23

Dont really have any for that. And it wasnt a problem for me. Always dry and shiny when I got off.

So maybe tell them its an issue and try a different cushion.

I just ordered 2 used Roho ones to try (again). They are terrible for stability, and transfering. And you need to check air and immersion level daily or so. All a royal pain. But so are sores. I paid 140 for one plus delivery as new, https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROHO-Quad-Se ... 2749.l2649

ROHO Quad Select wheelchair cushion.
19. 50" x 20.25" x 4.25"
49.5cm x 51.5cm x 10.5cm
Real size is about the same as my 18 x 20 Jay2 in all dimentions. Maybe half an inch wider. So be careful - they are smaller than the measurements suggest.

And only 110 for the other. They are Quadro Select high level ones (there are 2 depths). Both cushions are supposedly like new. One arrived, and it looks unused. The other is arriving from germany. And so cant say yet. He has 100% feedback so should be OK. Why do I need 2? I have a few chairs and one may puncture! And because I put a low bid in for both, and won! :oops:

They are smaller than the jay2 cushions I normally use if you order the same size in inches... :cussing I knew that from previous roho experience!
So in place of my 18 x 20 x 3, Jay2, I ordered the 19.5 x 20.5 x 4.25 (10 cells x 11 high) and it is size for size about 1/2 inch wider and same depth, and once sat in it lower than the Jay2. As you sink more. :lol: So I guessed corectly. You NEED the TALL one, and you need the Quadro or whatever they call the one with 4 seperate sections. Now the air cusion is cooler and less sweaty. And offeres slightly better protection against sores. But is way less easy to use and needs checking and maintainance!
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Frank » 03 Feb 2021, 09:08

Everyone has different needs. I have used a high-profile Roho cushion for over 40 years and never had a sore on them. In my opinion I think this is the best cushion for the prevention of sores . I sit in the chair for about 13 hours a day and find it very comfortable. I don’t check the air daily, I know when the cushion is going a little low and then I pump it a little but I do that after months. I do not do transfers. For stability and protection maybe the hybrid or Quattro Roho cushion is the correct one.
Frank
 
Posts: 33
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 11:17
Location: Malta

Re: New Q700R chair from a Wheelchair Budget - with 1k chang

Postby Burgerman » 03 Feb 2021, 09:53

I am going to start a thread on cushions. You can repeat this over there.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 54820
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

PreviousNext

Return to Everything Powerchair

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Burgerman, ex-Gooserider, Google [Bot] and 53 guests

cron

 

  eXTReMe Tracker