Speed Potential from scooter named Golden Buzzaround EX

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

Hello! My name is Charley.

I live in USA and own a mobility scooter that in USA is called a Golden Buzzaround EX.
In UK that same scooter is called a TGA Zest Plus.
It has a Dynamic 90A Type R controller.

I weigh 150 lbs (68 KG).
I am physically handicapped and used my mobility scooter for mobility and transportation.
My profession is computer IT software support and software engineer.

I have never programmed a scooter before. This will be a new experience for me. I am learning as I go.

Today I ordered a Dynamic brand DWIZ-KIT and OEM-U dongle from a scooter store in Taiwan that I found online.

I currently have two Powersonic PDC lead acid AGM U1 batteries 35 AH. So a 24V system using AGM.

What is top speed potential of my scooter by altering it's program with no physical modifications?

[Burgerman]

Probably non. Its likely set to max.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

I've read the controller's user manual.

There's adjustable parameters for:

Maximum Forward Speed, which can be set from 10% to 100%. Default is 60%.

Maximum Motor Voltage, which can be set from 2V to 40.2V. Default is 28.8V.

The manual contains the following note about the Max Motor Voltage setting:

"Note: If local regulations require scooter speed be limited to a specific value, use Max Motor Voltage parameter to set a speed limit for a particular scooter type (for specific motor and wheel diameter)."

Might I use one or both of those controller parameters to increase speed 1 mph?

Note: Technically I mean one additional mph. I already increased tire diameter 1" to get from 5 to 6 mph. Now I'm hoping to alter programmer parameters to get from 6 to 7 mph.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

My DWIZ kit has not yet arrived by mail, but trying to get a headstart on knowledge, I downloaded and read the user manuals for my controller and DWIZ-KIT.

I got the controller parameters info (mentioned in prior post) from the user manual for my controller. I read the manual hoping to learn some possibilities.

Until my DWIZ-KIT arrives, I can't yet know what my scooter controller's settings currently are.

[Dan]

It might be better to buy a 8MPH scooter and try and get 10MPH out of it. Your maximum voltage will ultimately be set by your batteries.
Measure your speed using GPS or time a known distance.
You may be able to make a programming lead?
https://www.wheelchairdriver.com/board/ ... 00#p173572

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

The kit I ordered is supposed to include a programming lead. I used a GPS speedometer to test my speed. My scooter went 5 mph with stock tires. I installed 1 inch taller tires. Now it goes 6 mph. I'm hoping that after my programming kit arrives, I hope to alter controller parameters to go 7 mph. I just want to eek out 1 more mph.

I'll just have to try it and see what happens.

[ex-Gooserider]

If the maximum speed is set to less than 100%, you will get some more speed depending on how much you increase it. On a power chair the voltage needs to be set a bit below the battery maximum to allow 'headroom' for steering or it will slow in corners. On a single motor scooter this doesn't apply, so set the voltage to near (or even a little above) the battery voltage.... It doesn't make a lot of difference since you can't get more voltage than your batteries have...

Note that you will probably get a bit less range if you up the speed - I don't know if this matters to you or not.

You shouldn't have any problem doing the programming as it is not at all like needing to write code, it is more of an exercise in adjusting parameter configuration.

ex-Gooserider

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

Thanks Gooserider. What you posted sounds like what I'm expecting. Hopefully its forward speed is not already set to 100%. If so, I will increase the speed setting to 100% and the max voltage as you suggested. With luck I will (hopefully) be able to go at least 1 mph faster.

The reasons I don't just buy a bigger, faster class 3 scooter are:

1) My small class 2 scooter is already paid for.

2) My scooter is one of the best and fastest class 2 boot sccoters (travel scooters) that is easy to disassemble and light enough for a woman to lift parts into a car trunk/boot.

3) My class 2 scooter is small enough to easily maneuver indoors in stores, doctors offices, etc yet is also big and fast enough to drive across town and back home.

4) My class 2 scooter is small enough to be allowed and welcome in stores, offices, and bank.

In summer I drive my scooter across town to stores, shopping, bank, and doctor's appointments. In winter my caregiver puts my disassembled scooter into car trunk/boot and we take my car to destinations' parking lot. Then caregiver reassembles scooter and then I drive my scooter from parking lot into the store, bank, or doctor office.

So I can't have a larger class 3 scooter, but I can (try to) make my small class 2 scooter as fast as possible for driving scooter outdoors across town and back home in summer.

[Burgerman]

Realistically you are trying to get a quart out of a pint pot.

The reason that the bigger scooters ARE bigger is because to get more speed really requires better tyres, wheels, suspension, and a bigger base (width and length) to give the required stability and safety and comfort at higher speeds like 8mph. And also because as soon as you increase the speed you really need bigger motors to maintain enough torque. And extra speed needs more battery current. Lots more. So that means a much bigger battery/controller and wiring.

Gaining a fraction of a mph, at best, is not really going to be noticible. So you may not have the space/money/all the other reasons you dont want a bigger scooter but thats why you are going slowly...

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

After my Dynamic DWIZ-KIT and OEM-U dongle arrive, I will give it a try and find out what it can do.

[Burgerman]

It will do very little in regards speed. If you raise the voltage a little and the batteries cant match it then it will go downhill faster. But not otherwise by much at all. Unless you do lithium. That has a slightly higher voltage and less voltage drop under load too because of both peukert and internal resistance reasons.

So you might gain a few percent extra that way. Maybe 5 percent. And much more range, and much longer service life.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

Every bit of speed and/or range improvement is welcome from any source. Lithium would also be lighter. So easier for my caregiver to lift into my car trunk/boot for winter excursions. She'd appreciate that.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

I improved max acceleration parameter's performance from sluggish to excessive. Now it feels like I was launched from a catapalt. It's now too much acceleration for comfort.

Next I'll going to try a max acceleration setting somewhere around medium acceleration.

I increased top speed by 0.5 mph by removing max speed limitation. It's now as much rpm as I can get with a 24V lead battery system.

However, I gained an additional 1 mph speed by installing 1" taller tires. To accomplish this on front wheel (of my 3 wheel scooter) my cousin installed a different steering headtube/fork from my larger model of mobility scooter of same brand. The new steering headtube and its bearings are same size, but the fork is larger and accommodates a taller tire.

Increasing diameter of rear wheels was easier. He removed wheel/tires from my large scooter and installed on my small scooter. He used an angle grinder to make a little more clearance for the 1" taller tires (which are also 0.5" wider tires).

My small scooter originally went 4 mph. It now goes 6.5 mph. That's fast enough for a small, portable travel-boot scooter.

My larger scooter originally went 5 mph. It will go 6.5 mph when we're done.

That's the limit of what we can accomplish with these scooters and their stock 24V systems. If we still wanted more speed, we'd need to step up to 36V, but it's not worth the effort to me.

[Burgerman]

I improved max acceleration parameter's performance from sluggish to excessive. Now it feels like I was launched from a catapalt. It's now too much acceleration for comfort.

Next I'll going to try a max acceleration setting somewhere around medium acceleration.

The throttle is proportional. YOU decide on the rate of acceleration. My Turbo suzuki that I used to drag race was also my roadbike. It could do 100 in under 4.5 seconds and hit 170 on the quarter mile in around 8. I still drove it as my daily driver and tootled round town fine!

I increased top speed by 0.5 mph by removing max speed limitation. It's now as much rpm as I can get with a 24V lead battery system.

However, I gained an additional 1 mph speed by installing 1" taller tires. To accomplish this on front wheel (of my 3 wheel scooter) my cousin installed a different steering headtube/fork from my larger model of mobility scooter of same brand. The new steering headtube and its bearings are same size, but the fork is larger and accommodates a taller tire.
Increasing diameter of rear wheels was easier. He removed wheel/tires from my large scooter and installed on my small scooter. He used an angle grinder to make a little more clearance for the 1" taller tires (which are also 0.5" wider tires).

Many do. But the problem with this is that if you go any further by increasing tyre size which is gearing then you will start running into a lack of torque and an increase in current at every speed. That ends in less range, less hill climb capability, greater controller heat etc.

My small scooter originally went 4 mph. It now goes 6.5 mph. That's fast enough for a small, portable travel-boot scooter.

How? Thats a 55% speed increase!

The problem is that having taller gearing (and/or larger wheels) means to keep adequate range and performance, if this is done by more than a small amount, it means you eventually end up with that 8mph or bigger scooter thats already faster. Taller gearng means bigger motors and controller as they make more heat and suck up more amps even when going slow. That needs bigger batteries, bigger higher amp controller, and a bigger heavier chassis/wheels to carry the weight, with heavier suspension that adds more size and weight..

So yes you can fiddle around at the edges a bit but ultimately its all a compromise. Thats why the faster scooters are bigger and heavier in the first place.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

I have a small travel/boot scooter and a medium size travel/boot scooter.

This post is about the small scooter.

I prefer my small scooter because my caregiver can lift the pieces and it fits in my car. Yet it's exceptionally capable for a travel-boot scooter because it has coil spring suspension and pneumatic tires for a comfortable ride.

Original speed 4 mph.
Original tire diameter 8".
New tire diameter 10.4".

The controller's original programming had rpm restricted to 85% of what the scooter is capable of. How do I know? Because it said in controller's program parameters "Max Forward Speed 85%".

4 mph x 10.4" diameter ÷ 8 diameter = 5.2 mph. That's with controller's forward speed limiter (rpm limit) restricting rpm to 85% of maximum.

Now change controller speed (rpm) limit from 85% to 100%.

100% - 85% = 15% increase rpm

or

100 ÷ 85% = 1.15 rpm

5.2 mph x 1.15 rpm = 5.98 mph.

That's how I calculated it should go 6 mph after mods.

However, after doing the mods, I tested using a GPS speedometer.

My small scooter now goes 6.4 to 6.5 mph according to GPS Speedometer. The reading frequently changes between 6.4 and 6.5 mph while driving on level pavement.

I also adjusted minimum speed (rpm) setting to allow it to go as slow as it originally did. This is useful for careful, slow driving when indoors.

I adjusted acceleration settings (again). This time to 5% more than stock.

Now I like it how it drives indoors and outdoors. I am very happy with the results.

I am aware that taller tires means higher gearing and more speed, but less torque. I'm fine with that because I only weigh 145 lbs and my scooter in stock form was rated for a 330 lbs person.

My tire diameter increase has made the scooter 30% higher geared. My body weight is 37% lighter than the stock scooter was rated to carry.

My stock scooter had more range.

So even if my modified scooter will have less torque and range than stock, it will still be more than good enough for a light weight skinny guy like me, and I will get enough extra speed to outrun most crackhead and to cut 10 minutes off my travel time each way for most trips.

I'm very happy with my results.

[YellowBuzzaroundEX]

In prior post, I meant to say...

My stock scooter had more than enough range for my needs (6 to 9 miles). So if my modified scooter has slightly less range, I will still be happy because I only need to drive 4 to 6 miles.

It's well worth it to me to trade some range for more speed.