Trouble in the Bronx ??

[fishinjunky]

Does your cable go from pl8 -> subd -> xt90 -> battery ring terminals?

[expresso]

Always good to double check things expresso.

Steve

Yes thats true - double and triple check - my mistake for not checking it after the charge cable was routed and left in its place - that cable was installed and zip ties used at a few spots - i should have checked at the moment - i didnt - then i was touched again another time - another person also touched it to just make it neater

it looked fine - - i am not able to get down to really see good for myself -

this time - i will make sure double checking and taking pictures so i can see how the cable rests -

[expresso]

Does your cable go from pl8 -> subd -> xt90 -> battery ring terminals?

No - the PL 8 has a charge cable with bananas and balance wires - with the Subd Male end -

[expresso]

SubD always that way - the correct way - i posted tons of pictures - same with the XT 90 was always used as part of my charging cable - Subd - one end - XT 90 the other end -

OK... SubD chair end of cable. And the other end goes to the PL8 which doesent have any XT90... So where are you pluging that into???

Its very hard to get a simple answer. You seem to have gone into full on panic mode, developed verbal diareah and typed a 30 page book of confusion. You keep on repeating yourself but never explaining or answering questions.

So take a deep breath and gather what you want to say first before typing half a dozen posts. Things are usually something simple. And then once you gathered your thoughts explain it clearly using logic. Because I still have no idea where on earth you can plug in (or or could need) anything other that the 4mm safe bannana connectors, along with the PL8s 9 pin balance connector at the charger end.

Why would there be an XT90??? What is that for? Its not in the charge cable, or on the chair???

Yes you are right - i do ramble on sometimes - as i am thinking - i think i am writing and you understand what i am thinking - thats not working out as you can see


its not hard to get a simple answer - the problem is also how its asked - makes no sense either - holes and pin etc, many times if not all the time - you make it harder to get a simple answer by the way you post -


ON the charger end - there is NO XT90 - never was -

i posted many many pictures - from the 7 years - you can see i use a XT 90 from the start on the charge cable Female end that goes on the chair - -

one end is the female SubD - the other end power lines are XT90 - that XT 90 gets plugged into the pack for charging only - the main lines go to the SB50 from pack to the chair

this simple enough - do you see it now how the XT 90 is in the picture here


7 years ago - my very first ADD On had a SB50 - only - found it too hard to unplug and plug all the time - so i went to XT 90 from then on - for charging - - Sub D female one end - the other end is XT90


look back - i am sure i have tons of pics to show that - i have XT 90 in all my packs in the pictures also i am sure


bottom line i am relieved to find out what caused it -

[Burgerman]

I know.

However you did it again.

ON the charger end - there is NO XT90 - never was -
i posted many many pictures - from the 7 years - you can see i use a XT 90 from the start on the charge cable Female end that goes on the chair - -

Does anyone else have any clue what that actually means? You have a 40A capable SubD at the chair end. That contains all the wires, power and balance in one. Thats the whole point of it. No XT90 required anywhere. And you still keep talking about an XT90 because andersons are too stiff for you. But you should not have either!

one end is the female SubD - the other end power lines are XT90 - that XT 90 gets plugged into the pack for charging only - the main lines go to the SB50 from pack to the chair

Thats done it. I need a . I have no clue what that sentence means. SHOW me a phoo of the charge cable ends!!!

this simple enough - do you see it now how the XT 90 is in the picture here :thumbup

You didnt post any pictures.

[expresso]

WHOW really - you not getting it yet - BM come on now - your slipping there


its simple how i explained it -

OK - let me make it easy for you - lets forget about the PL 8 charger - lets just think of the chair now -

yes subd has all the wires inside and where do those wires go -? to the battery pack in the chair right ?

and how does the subD with all the wires inside connect to the battery pack in the chair ?


you have two 12awg cables and balance wires inside the SudD ?

soldered to the connector with the Holes

thats one end of the charge cable isnt it ?

whats on the other end ?

i used XT90 on the other end of that Sub D - let me find the few thousand pictures i may have - i get back with pictures for you to see - now you know why i like taking pictures --


you been focused the whole time on the PL 8 end of this - forget that- has nothing to do with XT90 on the PL 8 charger end -


I be back as he said

[Burgerman]

What for? On my chairs the SubD then goes to the battery in the same way as the charger and. The main power wires go from the subD to the 0v and 24v on the battery. So do the balance wires. Why would you add an xt90 connector in the wiring?

you have two 12awg cables and balance wires inside the SudD ?

soldered to the connector with the Holes

thats one end of the charge cable isnt it ?

whats on the other end ?

The battery ring terminals. Or should be. Why add another connector???

[expresso]

Why you ask ?

the first reason and maybe only reason i did it was - to remove the pack from the chair - how do you do that if you have all the cables direct from SudD to the pack ? i made all my packs Modular sort of speak - to remove the pack - i disconnect the charge cable from the pack - disconnect main chair connector and slide it out

charge cable stays put - i am surprise you didnt make it that way - to remove your pack - you have to remove the whole charge cable with it at one time ?

here are some pics -so many over the 7 years - i think i made about 7 packs - ADD ON and full packs during this time - i am SURE i posted these pics and many more over the years - and look at them - XT90 in all the pictures - and you were to the one to tell me about the XT90 to begin with

i didnt know anything about this or connectors etc, - you told me about it - i looked at it and decided i will use it - i am not say your told me to use it - you introduced me to them - as another option for what i was looking to do - mainly started because SB50 was hard for the girls to connect and disconnect each time - remember ADD On packs - to charge them i had to disconnect them from the main pack first -

and the main packs in the chair - little room - so i went with the XT90 there also for the size and easier for anyone to uplug them if needed - - i found them very useful for many things - i used them since day one practically - why is this such a surprise to everyone now - that worries me - mental health is a serious thing


thats a joke - dont take everything i say serious all the time - but really i only got this info from you and here - XT 90 and so on -

ok here are some of the pictures - some of the packs - XT 90 you can see in all of them

[expresso]

and

[expresso]

and

[expresso]

and

[expresso]

The ring terminals that go on the pack have an end to one side -

i either cut a large 36 inch cable - use a shorter end - add the rings and connect to the battery -

the rest of the cable is soldered to the SudD - and they connect together - think Modular

same with the charging cable - i have cables with XT90 connected to the pack 24V -

same as the balance wires - modular - i can disconnect the XT90 - disconnect the balance wires - disconnect the Main chair SB50 - bingo - pack is free to move out of the chair - easy - charge cable stays put -

when done slide it back in - reconnect them - close the box - hopefully all good to go -

[expresso]

i no longer use an ADD ON since i went to 200ah packs all in the chair

only the bounder now i use one - but i still have an 60ah ADD ON - headways 45ah ADD ON - 36ah headways ADD ON - used on my indoor chair only -

now i have two ADD ONs sitting doing nothing -

i can use one for my friend as i spoke before to give him the range to go out and ride - thats the 60ah i offered him -

now because of what happened - i am thinking of replacing the head ways with 200ah also - this way i have 3 chairs i can use all with range i need - bounder i really dont want to use much - since the headways are now about 80ah going on close to 7 years from 105ah when new

[expresso]

have a on me

[Burgerman]

and you were to the one to tell me about the XT90 to begin with

Yes to connect an addon...

[expresso]

and you were to the one to tell me about the XT90 to begin with

Yes to connect an addon...

yes and ever since then i been using the XT90 - i used them for everything since - other than the Main 24V SB50 always -

they are compact size that works fine - for those needs -

i am glad that its safe to say it was the charge cable that got worn down and exposed the balance wires causing a short - now the challenge is when i install it again the new cable - how to route it so it dosnt happen again -

[expresso]

tell me BM - if i were to make the charge cable and power cables on there own - instead of both cables in ONE Ring - would that affect it worse in terms of IR or other wise or not a big deal ?

now i have the chance to redo the cables if it may be easier to route - or just leave it alone both in one Ring ?


Also another thing - we got caught up over this XT thing - what do you feel about the Cable having a bend after the fuse - as i mentioned - it seems a bit softer there somewhat -


could the wire be damaged or weaken there you think ? i am trying to figure out if i should leave it as is both in ONE Ring end - or make sets of cables - to route different


or make it work as is - if i do two sets of cables - will have 2 rings on the 24V post plus the balance ring - now i only have one ring plus the balance ring

[Burgerman]

One ring or two? Will make around as much difference as your additional XT90...
And a bent wire is fine the elctricity doesent care about corners.

[expresso]

One ring or two? Will make around as much difference as your additional XT90...
And a bent wire is fine the elctricity doesent care about corners.

ok i think i may make two sets now - i like to route the charger set towards the rear and out the side - closer to the charge cable end will be -

and the main 24v power shorter and put the fuse closer to the connector to sit it even with no bends too close


The area where it was kept bent more - is right after the ring to the fuse - it feels as if its softer there now - from the bend ? do you think the strands inside are not affected or could be broken - ? the outer shells are all fine - not cuts etc on the silicone part

i want to not make the same mistake with how i route the charge cable - now is a good time to try to arrange it better the wiring since i dont have room to spare -


Can the strands inside the cable be broken if the outershell is not - is that even possible ?

[Burgerman]

Can the strands inside the cable be broken if the outershell is not - is that even possible ?

highly unlikely. But with you anything is possible. But only you can know as your the only one that can see or handle it.

[expresso]

true -

hard to explain - but if you take a cable and bend it back and forth over and over - lets say - kinda of feels weaker at the one spot - the bend -

i will cut it anyway since i want to make that cable shorter now - put the fuse back in a different spot so when plugged in - it should be straight and then bend inside to the pack on a easier curve the bend -

if you look at the pictures the first sets of pictures of the melted balance wires - they are together with zip tie - the one with the fuse - you may be able to see it


the other thing - about what happened - Was there any real danger to me during this time i was out riding with that shorted cable ?

[shirley_hkg]

No way you can break the strands, with bare hands, by bending it once , unless with tools or wagging a lots .

Balance leads are thin and burnt away like a fuse this time. Chances are that they don't , and happens in your sleep quietly.
Short circuit generates heat , so there are always risk of fire.

[expresso]

Ok what can i do to make it safer now


is there a better way to protect those balance wires - - i mean its safe as long as you never get a short ?

this happened because of that charge cable - scrapped and exposed them - is there better ways for me to be safer this time around -

i will double check and triple check this time to make sure the cable is not tight in between anything etc,

maybe i wrap those balance leads with tape - to at least keep them less exposed - this was the last thing i would have though of to be concerned about -

[shirley_hkg]

Most importantly is to play attention to layout/route of wiring. Figure out how to avoid pressure and hard , sharp objects .
I use this in high risk areas.

[fishinjunky]

A tight zip tie can also cause a wear point over time. I used thin velcro strips for organizing wires instead.

I used this to wrap my balance wires. But I like the sleeving shirley_hkg posted better
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07JNNT3CM/re ... UTF8&psc=1

[LROBBINS]

After multiple cases of pinched wires in moving machinery (and lots of magic smoke) I have taken to using a dab of my favorite - Goop a.k.a. E6000 - to tack wires down so they stay in place.

For my last bit of chair wiring I found an Aliexpress seller for fiberglass-covered, silicone-insulated wire. Silicone insulation is very flexible and heat resistant, but easily cut, so I'd avoided it before this. With the fiberglass it seems much less damage prone. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001211751252.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2ita&spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef36961rcZGP Though this page doesn't show it, they can also supply 10mm^2 and others.

[expresso]

thanks for the suggestions - i think the PVC fiberglass sleeving is the one i should get now - i dont have time for china orders -

i need this today - i will search on amazon - - to fit the balance wires - what size would i need -

i have no idea how it was zip tied the charge cable this time around - i am sure she though it was better to hold it in place at the time - not realizing it would move etc,

i cant say because i didnt see it after it was done - i trusted that i was all good - - nothing i can do now - i have to check myself this time - with pictures so i can see it -

i want to try to get this done this week - so i can install it again on friday - but i dont want to rush either now -

i will see if i can run the balance wires and charge cables to the rear of the pack - meaning front of the chair side - and snake it out the side - where the charge cable would be - and plug it in there - instead of trying to have them in the rear of the chair - - leaving just the main SB50 in the rear to connect

i have to see if there is room on the side to do that - near the spring - motor etc, theres where i snaked the charge cable - someone how it was managed to reach the back - and all connected - maybe it was too much - cable may have been shorter than what was needed - and must have been scrapping on the frame

i will make some extension XT90 and if needed use it - extend balance cables also if needed - i rather not do that and have it connected on the side now

i have to take pictures of inside the chair area again and look

this is my first chair i did - going on 7 years now - its now my spare back up chair that i will use next week now -

had no issues with this one - i havent opened that box in years to look - i have no reason to do so

i have to see on my new chair - its the same chair - should be the same -

the difference now is the pack itself - the first chair with headways - had an extra row on top - dosnt cover the whole thing so i had some space to lay the wiring there -

this pack its one solid pack same size all around - i dont have to room to lay the wiring on top now - - i will try doing it with no top cover on the battery so i can see - better - and once i feel its good - i add the cover again

[expresso]

is a 2mm sleeving good for the balance wires only ?

and what if i wanted to cover some other cables like 12 awg and 10awg - etc. 5 mm ? ID

i want to order a few different size - how do you get it to say put - tape on the edges ?

thanks

[Burgerman]

Think about the stock chairs. Theres no fancy sleeving or anything they just rout the cables where they wont be trapped or damaged. You are overthinking everything.

[expresso]

Think about the stock chairs. Theres no fancy sleeving or anything they just rout the cables where they wont be trapped or damaged. You are overthinking everything.

yes but its OK - i rather be safe - since i am no expert - i should have double triple checked that cable when it was installed - i looked at my first chair same chair - i actually now dont like where its resting either - the difference there is - its resting on the thick heat shrink i used - and its not bent going back etc,

in the side and on the battery where i had room to lay the wiring - so its not bent and coming back - but i will add some extra cushion there also around the cable where its resting on the motor mount

on the new one - i am thinking of changing the location all together - i will see if have a an opening in the front of the chair under the seat- put the SubD there facing forward - and cable going straight back in the battery area connect it and cover the top of the battery again - that sounds better to me - if i have a way to do that

this may take a few weeks now - i dont have the help as i once did with this as good now - so i will try to get the wiring redone - and want to work with my friday night girl to actually finish and install it - if i miss one friday - then another week