Ramp & door, opening & closing unreliable

[mamacookybear]

We recently bought a 2005 Dodge Caravan with mobility adaptions. The door should open & ramp come down when you
push the button on the dashboard or key. And of course do the reverse when you want to close it up. However, it only
Does this about 50% of the time. The rest of the time the door may open but the ramp not come down, or the door may
refuse to close, it goes nearly closed & then reopens again & again, or I may have to get out & start the ramp coming down
manually, or close the door manually. It does not give me much confidence in using it, I'm afraid I'll get stranded somewhere away from home with my disabled husband, or be stuck with him in the car, & unable to get him out. Does any
one out there have suggestions about what our mechanic needs to try in order to get it working correctly 100% of the time?
Mama Cooky Bear

[falco peregrinus]

There is the possibility of a bad (ie, iffy) electrical connection, but to two places? Perhaps, but that's not the only possible explanation. Seems how it's second hand, (and had seven years of use, presumably), I'd be also considering the possibility that something in the mechanism needs cleaning and/ or lubricating, so it can move more freely. I'm thinking that the motor/ gearbox combinations for the two devices (door, ramp) are not overengineered, and are adequate for new condition but don't have the power to cope with dirty or inadequately lubricated mechanical components after the motor/gearbox. For example, in my van, I have to clean and lubricate the sliding door tracks every year or two or it becomes difficult and noisy to slam the door shut. That friction, resulting from grit and dirt build-up over time, together with lubricant evaporation over time, would result in increased load and demand on an electric motor if I had an electric door opener. (And in theory could result in a burnt out motor if it got bad enough.)
I wouldn't disregard the possibility that there is a poor electrical connection somewhere in the circuit, but friction from built-up grit and evaporated lubricant is a strong possibility. I'd be suggesting a thorough clean and relubrication, plus pull apart and push back together again every electrical connection between the power source and the motors, including the switch if you can manage to get to it. (I say if, because on my van getting behind the dashboard is a very time-consuming job, which translates to very expensive if you're paying someone else to do it.)
Falco

[tomcmo]

Hi, I had exactly the same problem on my 2010 Voyager. The door has to fully activate a catch at the end of the door travel when it opens to deploy the ramp. I had to have the sliding door re-aligned to ensure that it fully deployed the catch. Now and again if i'm parked at an odd angle the problem re-emerges. Obviously we have different models and the mechanisms may be different but FWIW that is my experience.

[Burgerman]

They all seem to do this now and again. one in 10 times I open the door the ramp stays up. Press button again and it closes. Start again, all ok...

Same with door closing. Now and again it gets 99 percent closed and decides to re-open. But always works next time.

They sense current, and complete opening and closing. Not always reliably. But better than trapping some-ones fingers etc.

I wouldn't worry about it. Mines been doing it for 7 years...

[ex-Gooserider]

I have the same problem... I'd agree with the comments about cleaning and lubing all the mechanical bits. I believe there are also some limit switches in the mechanism that can cause problems if they are out of adjustment.

You don't say where you are from (it really helps if you can go to the User Control Panel near the top of the page and fill in your location) or who did the conversion, but conversions are supposed to have manual over-rides that will let you get the ramp up / down and open / close the door without using the automatic buttons....

On my 2010 Braun T&C conversion, the ramp can be pushed open to deploy it, and there is a switch down near the floor on the rear door pillar that will directly drive the motor that stows it, or (with difficulty) you can lift the outside end and stow it manually. Similarly you should be able to reach, or have extension straps that let you work the door handle to open and close it manually... This means that it might be a pain, but you shouldn't have to much concern about getting stranded after you learn how to work the over-rides.

ex-Gooserider

[falco peregrinus]

Ex-GooseRider found the words to say something that was rattling around in the back of my brain about this problem, but I never quite figured out what it was that I wanted to say until I read his post. Now I know. He mentioned the limit switches. As he said, if they are out of adjustment, they can cause problems. An analogy is windscreen wiper motors. They incorporate (or, at least used to forty years ago) limit switches to make sure that after the wiper switch is turned off, the wipers remain in motion until they reach the home position. It used to be quite common to encounter cars where the wipers worked, but no longer automatically retuned to the home position after the wiper switch on the dashboard was turned off. The cause was generally worn-out or gummed up limit switch mechanism.
In my earlier post I mentioned bad electrical connections possibly causing the problems. Now I'd like to suggest a refinement of that. Switches are mechanical-electrical devices, and they do wear out. The better the quality (as indicated by the manufacturer's MTBF [mean time between failures} rating), the longer they last before they fail. There are two ways they fail: they physically break and no longer turn on (or off), or, more commonly, they become "iffy". Temperamental. Sometimes work, sometimes not. The limit switches in windscreen wipers are (or used to be) built into the motors, but from previous posts on this topic, it would seem that the limit switches on the devices we're discussing here are generally separate switches, located well away from the motors.
Switches are generally quite cheap things. I think it would be a sound investment to replace all the limit switches (whilst taking all care to ensure that the new ones are correctly adjusted to do their job) and see whether that brings improvement. (As well as clean and lubricate the mechanical components, including the door tracks and rollers.)
Falco

[Burgerman]

In the case of braun/rollx etc and the Chrysler vans, the limit switches, (there are 3) are micro switches on the shaft that drives the ramp. There are 3 cams, and these work common micro switches. These are a bitch to set correctly, the cams are adjustable. With an allen key. And I have been there! One controls when the power turns OFF as the ramp rises. Too far? Bends things... Or blows a fuse. Not enough? ramp doesent power in quite far enough. Door will not shut. One controls how far it is powered DOWN. Too far? Tries to push the ramp into the deck. Not enough? Lets the ramp drop the last foot and will not power back up... Third one I forget what it did but I left that alone.

The DOOR doesn't use limit switches as such, it has a current sensor, built into the van. This sees amps rise, if there's an obstruction and either reverses the door, or turns the motor off if its closed. How does it know its shut? The closing latch tells it... And theres a hall sensor to tell it when its FULLY on some. On others it relies on time/current rise.

The problem is that the door is modified, heavier and doesn't slide as easily as stock, so the van sees an obstruction much easier. Or the ramp doesn't wind in far enough, due to aforementioned cam and it reopens. Same thing. The door has to push it UP the last inch.

So a slope, something rocking the van from the inside, or a computer error, or stiff door, badly adjusted micro switch, or a hall sensor that does not see a fully open door (may be JUST 1 mm difference) will all cause errors.

When all is setup correctly, they work about 95 percent of the time, and the other 5 means try it again! And when adjusted to close properly they don't rattle at all as you drive.

[dannos85]

Hi Guys,
What a nightmare... My 2004 Chrysler Voyager Braun Entervan has never had any real problems, UNTIL NOW.
I arrived at a mate's house this afternoon, Pressed the button to get out & only the door opened. The ramp did not move & the suspension device made a brief noise & did nothing more.
Pressed the button again & the door shuddered & a catch in the door clicked once whilst the ramp is just flat out not working. I had to get my mate's carer to fold it away and shut the door manually. (same when I got home, asked a neighbour to shut it up).

In this case I'm thinking the controller to the ramp is at fault, Is there a fuse for this & where is it located?

[Burgerman]

The brauns computer should have a reset button. The Rollx ones do.

Did you try pressing it? It may have lost its mind...

[dannos85]

No, I was not aware of a reset button. I know the braun corporation box/computer is in the Jack Compartment,
I will get someone to reach in & press that in the morning if its obvious to find.
I'll let you know if it helps. Thanks

I could attack the switches with some contact spray.

[Burgerman]

Or disconnect its power under the bonnet, for half hour.

[dannos85]

No Reset Button. Will find someone to disconnect my battery & Try that.

Don't fancy Driving all the way the SDL in Hemel Hempstead, Nor do I want to pay there prices per hour, per labourer!...

[Burgerman]

I did a vid. This is what mine does on a good day about 9 times out of 10.

The 1 out of 10 it doesn't, I just reopen or reclose and it works. Dog is in my driving space...

www.wheelchairdriver.com/gopro/ramp.mp4

[Lord Chatterley]

No Reset Button. Will find someone to disconnect my battery & Try that.

Don't fancy Driving all the way the SDL in Hemel Hempstead, Nor do I want to pay there prices per hour, per labourer!...

Raise the ramp, start engine, drive forward a feet feet. Switch off. Lower ramp.

Usually works.

LC