Any advice on equipment choices?

[ex-Gooserider]

I just got the rough draft of the evaluation report for my test to see if I could resume driving, and if so, what kind of setup I'd need... There were some choices, and would like to hear comments from anyone that has had more practice on this stuff than I have - my total HP driving experience was about an hour in the evaluator's test vehicle... As a reminder, I'm in the US, so it will be a US available vehicle, left hand drive, etc... w/ equipment that meets US regs and all that... Disability is a T-5 para, incomplete, w/ a slightly dodgy right shoulder. Unless things work out differently time-wise than expected, I will be initially using my Jazzy 1100 in the vehicle, and eventually replacing it (I hope) with a BM2/3 type chair....

Relevant sections of the report quoted... (reformatted and lightly edited to save space)

Vehicle type and original equipment (OEM) Mini-van; Automatic transmission; Power steering; Power brakes; Check with evaluator before purchasing, see Vehicle Entry comment below

Vehicle entry - Lowered floor, 10- inches, see comment; Side entry; Powered door opener / closer; Powered ramp
Comment: A lowered floor conversion by BraunAbility or Vantage Mobility International of the Chrysler / Dodge, Honda, or Toyota minivans is suggested. Seated height in his w / c is 52-inches; the 10-inch lowered floor will provide him adequate entry height through the side door and an appropriate sight line through the windshield.

So far so good - I've asked on W/C Junkie, and the folks there showed a slight preference for Braun, but nothing really negative about VMI. RollX isn't an option since they don't have dealers in MA that can bid on the job. I can't see any major differences between the two companies that would make me want to rule either one out. I'm inclined more towards a folding ramp than an in-floor, otherwise not a lot of choices here.

Driver Safety and Mobility Device Securement Systems -Wheelchair tie-down occupant restraint system, automatic, driver position, passenger position see comment

Comment: The client uses a Pride Jazzy 1100 power w / c. EZ Lock and Q’straint each have a power system for the w / c. I suggest a powered system in the passenger position as well for safety.

EZ-lock seems to be the big player for lockdown setups, at least that is the one everyone talks about... However looking at the two, I don't see a huge amount of difference, although the newer QLK 150 from Q'Straint seems to have a better warranty, more crash testing, and a few other features that seem a little better.

It may just be from looking at the US websites, but neither company lists having brackets for the F55 chairs - is this going to be an issue?

One thing I've heard a little about, but not much detail, is that some of the HP stuff, especially an EZ-Lock, can supposedly kill a car's battery in a few days of non-use... Any truth to this? Ways to prevent it from happening?

Primary Control -
Right-hand operated mechanical brake & gas control, push / rotary type, see comment
Spinner knob, mounted at 8 o’clock as steering wheel design allows, client decision, see comment
Brake and gas pedal block, see comment

Comment: In consideration of the client’s motorcycle experience the rotary type gas control is preferred. Wells-Engberg is the only known manufacturer of this type of control for right-hand operation. The spinner knob will be used for access to some secondary controls as well—see Secondary Controls, with vehicle in motion comment below.

Secondary Controls, with vehicle in motion - Raised buttons, on spinner knob, or spinner knob base, see comment
Turn signals; Headlight beam selector; Wiper / wash; Cruise control set; Horn

Comment: The Mini-Touch from Access Unlimited and the CPO-5 from dSI are suggested product choices. The order of the functions should be determined by the client.

I like the idea of an MC throttle style gas control, but have never used one, do they work as well as they sound like they should?
The secondary control choice seems to be between having a spinner knob w/ switches in it, and switches mounted on the spinner knob base where it attaches to the wheel. I was given a very short opportunity to play with the CPO-5, which is the knob with the switches in it, and I found it a bit hard to hit just one switch, but that may have been just a case of not being used to the thing. Is there much of a reason to prefer either one? Is it feasible to mount added switches on the throttle / brake housing to take some of the load off the other hand?

Secondary Controls, other -
Park brake extension: A manual extension will be needed. Mobility Products and Design is the suggested manufacturer. It is anticipated the client will not need devices for any other secondary controls. If a need is identified during training recommendations will be written at that time

This seems about right... I can think of a few extra functions I wouldn't mind being able to play with while driving, such as the radio volume, or the heat/AC stuff, but I can live without those if I have to...

Comments appreciated....

Ex-Gooserider

[Martin O Refurbisher]

I can't be much help, but .....

Spinner knob - great, but care needed when going over centre, i.e. changing from push to pull and vice versa, if like me you have a weak wrist.

M/c twist grip - I found these great, so long as properly set up in terms of rotational range and friction.

I have a locking base for an F55. I'll dig it out and take a picture for you - it may take a few days though.

All else is US specific and outside my knowledge.

Best,

Martin

[ex-Gooserider]

A picture of the F55 base would be great... I would think it wouldn't be anything that unusual, since it seems all the chairs operate on the same idea of a big bolt going into a hitch plate, the question is what I'd need for the chair (which would presumably be custom on a BMx chair anyway) and possibly whatever front stabilizer stuff (which nobody seems to talk about much) is appropriate...

If I end up doing the F55 deal with you, I may want to get the bracket from you as part of the package if it looks like something that would be UK specific...

I didn't find the spinner knob to be a big issue when I was doing the evaluation driving test, hard to say for certain what it would be like long term... One thing that was a little interesting is that when I was doing some web searching while writing the OP, I found a few additional options that hadn't been on my evaluator's list, and that he hadn't mentioned in our discussions - I've sent him the links, will see what he has to say. I especially liked the looks of the Creative Controls "LogiTouch" unit, but would like to get a "hands on" feel for it to see how it is to reach and operate from the knob...

Ex-Gooserider

[Martin O Refurbisher]

Yuo should hget the pics i nthe next couple of days.

Best,

Martin

[Martin O Refurbisher]

A supplier of WAV conversions I have come across who is new to me is:

http://www.oh-mobility.co.uk

Best,

Martin

[ex-Gooserider]

Mildly jealous.. Seems like you folks have a LOT more choices than we do here in the US... We have lots of conversion outfits, but most just do the same basic minivans, with a FEW doing other vehicles (mostly at outrageous prices)...

Of course part of this seems to be that you appear to have a lot more choices in non-modified vehicles, particularly in the smaller than mini-van sizes.

This may change given the push the gov't is making to improve fuel efficiency, but I'm not holding my breath...

ex-Gooserider

[Burgerman]

Well... There are litterally hundreds of small vans/cars, and loads are converted or convertable.

But I bought a US Rollx Dodge because it was about half the cost of a sensible sized uk right hand drive drive from wheelchair van. So count yourself lucky! And your fuel is about 3x cheaper too! If it wasnt, then you would see the rash of tiny vans/cars and electric cars etc that are spreading over here...

And of course you COULD do this in reverse. And buy a UK or European (left drive) van/car and have it sent by UPS...

[Martin O Refurbisher]

ex-G
Most of the bigger conversions use the Ricon tail lift, electric door kits and remotes, all from the US! In UK these are used widely in larger WAVs, taxis, patient transport by hospitals and ambulances, etc. so it seems this is the tail lift to have (and the one I'm told comes in my new WAV from Motability later this month!)

Best,

Martin

[ex-Gooserider]

Well... There are litterally hundreds of small vans/cars, and loads are converted or convertable.

But I bought a US Rollx Dodge because it was about half the cost of a sensible sized uk right hand drive drive from wheelchair van. So count yourself lucky! And your fuel is about 3x cheaper too! If it wasnt, then you would see the rash of tiny vans/cars and electric cars etc that are spreading over here...

Agreed on all counts, far as it goes... I'm expecting to see more econo-boxes showing up now (and not-so-econo boxes, the various Mini's are very popular over here, at a price that is higher than lots of bigger "luxury" cars...)

And of course you COULD do this in reverse. And buy a UK or European (left drive) van/car and have it sent by UPS...

True, and it looks like some would fit in a UPS maximum size box too...

Two big problems with doing the reverse trip...

1. From your description, there is a UK equivalent Mopar van model, so, aside from your's having the steering wheel in the proper place, parts aren't a big deal... If I bring in a micro-car with no US model, I'd have a difficult time getting parts / service in anything resembling a timely manner...

2. Again from your description, it sounds like there aren't all that many hassles involved in importing a car into the UK - some paperwork, but nothing prohibitive... Bringing a Non-US made car into the US has HUGE issues for any car you want to drive on the street... You are required to prove that the car meets US standards for emissions, crash safety, and so on, essentially by having the car put through the same certification tests that a US model must go through, at your expense... This can get prohibitively expensive, especially since some of the standards are really nasty, like requiring US specific labeling on windshields, or that your speedometer has MPH markings that are bigger than the metric ones...

ex-Gooserider

[ex-Gooserider]

ex-G
Most of the bigger conversions use the Ricon tail lift, electric door kits and remotes, all from the US! In UK these are used widely in larger WAVs, taxis, patient transport by hospitals and ambulances, etc. so it seems this is the tail lift to have (and the one I'm told comes in my new WAV from Motability later this month!)

Best,

Martin

I see a lot of Ricon lifts in the paratransits that I use, but arguably Braun is a slightly bigger name... Both seem to be a bit problematic by the time the vehicles get down the ownership chain to the point where the paratransit outfits are owning them - these services are running on low-bid contracts, so they save by using vehicles that are often in really sad shape, often I wonder how they got past the basic state safety inspections, as I can see rejection reasons from my chair...

However, where I see the big difference in choices is that the UK / EU seems to have lots more options for SMALL WAV's where mostly the US outfits only offer the mini-van jobs, mostly Mopar, Honda Odyssey or Toyota Sienna based...

ex-Gooserider