In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

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In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby weelz58 » 08 Dec 2019, 19:54

I'm in the process of applying for a new power chair. Medicare is my primary insurance than my father's policy is secondary. For the last 20+ years I have been using a FWD chair. Have used an Omegatrac in 98 to now currently using an Invacare FWD for the last 6 years.

After having used an FWD chair for quite some time, I am kind of partial to them as of right now. However, I demoed a Permobil F3, Quickie S-646, and a Frontier V6 MWD chair.

I would really have liked to try a Frontier V6 FWD, but they are not Group 3 coded for any kind of Medicare reimbursement or coverage and unfortunately I cannot buy one out-of-pocket at this time. The Frontier FWD would have been my first choice if it was at least partially paid for by Medicare.

After spending quite a bit of time reading around here on what seems to me like an incredibly awesome site for info about power mobility devices, I have narrowed my choices down to the Quickie RWD and Frontier MWD. I more than likely will not go with the RWD as the chair I demoed was 18" wide and the seat and backrest was not comfortable at all as I need a 16" width seat and backrest to be comfortable and not float around. Also because the rep from Quickie will not give me at least a full 2 or 3 days to give the chair a really good try out.

With that said, I will more than likely shoot for the Frontier V6 MWD chair. Reasons are: Fairly comfortable and smooth ride even with narrow indoor drive wheels. I do have some extra bucks where I could buy the ATV drive tires and larger caster wheels as an upgrade. Also, narrowed this choice down to being able to procure the capability to do some customized drive setting programming by getting the dongle that everybody talks about here. This I will have to talk to BM at length off-line.

First off, I am definitely not an electronics guru. I know just enough to get myself in trouble.

However, I have a few questions:

Has anyone, who has this chair, ever had any serious problems with either the electronics, motors, or other mechanical issues? If so, how long did it take you to get the parts to get the situation fixed? If I am right, I believe the main supplier is out in Indiana or somewhere in the Midwest?

This I do know about power chairs as has also been discussed here. You always want to try and get the highest amp rated joystick if possible. By the way, I am looking for all the help I can get. So if I am wrong on anything I say here, please correct me and let me know what the best way is to correct my thinking.

I will be getting the R-Net controller with the Frontier. I do not see anywhere in their specifications about the amperage of that controller. Are they available in 100A or possibly 120A?

Anyone that uses this chair with the ATV tires, are you able to get into a minivan with the wide beast? I have pretty much just enough room getting my Invacare and/or the Omegatrac in my minivan now. However, they are much narrower than the MWD with the fat tires.

Has anyone using the ATV tires got a flat tire out in the middle of nowhere? How did you handle the situation?

Is using the pneumatic casters that much smoother of a ride then the solid casters? As you can see with these last 2 questions, a concerning theme of mine is if I was to use pneumatic tires, is it really worth it versus using the solid casters and drive tires?

The C7 model has smaller front casters than the back ones. If I was to buy the larger size casters for the front, would I also need to get new forks for the bigger size tires and rims? In conjunction with this, if I was to put on the ATV drive tires and large casters all the way around, will the chair still stay level and how would this be done? Is it something I would have to readjust manually?

I see that there is an optional accessory power port to plug in 12V accessories and charge via USB. Is this set up with a step down transformer attached to both batteries so both batteries are drained equally rather than attached to one of the batteries thus having them drained unequally?

Some of these accessories are crazy expensive and I think could probably be made by a friend of mine for a much cheaper price.

Thank you everyone here for your time and help answering these questions. Thank you Burgerman for starting and continuing to maintain an incredibly awesome resource for powered mobility devices.
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby Irving » 08 Dec 2019, 21:38

A few quick answers

RNet controllers come in 80, 90 and 120A - only 120A is worth having esp on the heavier chair... (RNet available on Quickie too)

USB adapter and 12v adapters will be wired for 24v input, but can be sourced on eBay for around $10 each and easily fitted with a little ingenuity. Only you can decide if the extra $$$ for built in is a better option.

AFAIK the ATV tyres will make it around 28 - 29" wide
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby Swan T.W. » 09 Dec 2019, 16:30

RollinPositive has a V6 Frontier MWD, PM him.
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby FrontierNZ » 10 Dec 2019, 06:50

Hi there,

This is my experience of my ownership of a Frontier All-Terrain. I come from New Zealand, and I’ve lived with the wheelchair not as my main daily driver but as a recreational wheelchair that’s used occasionally; it’s got low mileage on it 1230 km.

Personally, I haven’t had any difficulty with thermal lockout or (in my usage case there being was no lack of power). Qualifying this, I don’t push the wheelchair very hard, mainly driving it on pavement and doing some inside work. I have been on the occasional off-road track.

I haven’t tried it on the beach although that’s always an ambition for me to do one day. Because I funded the chair solely on my own (it was a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity) wheelchair and seat (rehab combination) was approximately NZ$39,000 at the end of 2015.

I echo the sentiments that Dan said in the previous post that the build quality is very good, but it can be a little bit harder to use in a limited space environment. I have another wheelchair which is about a year older which I use my daily driver (a TA IQ mid wheel drive) this chair has 3227 km on it currently). I think with the smaller drive tires the frontier would definitely be a more viable every day cruiser.

Consider trying the chair with the stock controller first, and if you need the 120 amp you will know pretty soon.

My daily driver has a 120 amp controller but in my usage of both wheelchairs I’ve never really pushed the limit (I know that there are many people that do); Dan tells me that fitting the 120 amp controller actually improved not just the performance but also the battery range which is interesting.

The most I managed safely on a battery is about 17 or 18 km, with stock lead batteries of course battery range is not going to be as good as say a well thought out lithium installation as many of the other posters on this site would attest.

If you would like me to answer any specific questions you are more than welcome to leave a reply below

Good luck on your wheelchair purchasing decision

Malcolm.
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Permobil M3 2022 (Funded)

Frontier V6 Mid Wheel Drive 2015 {Self Purchased}
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby Burgerman » 10 Dec 2019, 09:40

Let me show you the reported Amps, with a properly programmed chair. The R-Net allows you to see how many Amps are required in real time on your laptops screen.

This is a zero speed turn in place in my hallway on thick carpet. In a typical powerchair (rehab seating, 20 stone user = heavy).

Note that almost 120A is REQUIRED to make it respond to the joystick in linear fashion. It will/may respond in a NON linear fashion with less amps available. But that means unpredictability of outcome. As in, it doesent follow the joystick accurately. For proper linear control on a well programmed chair 120A actually needed even in your house.

A right turn... Note M1 and M2 (motor amps) here. This would increase further on a slope as you turn, or on sand /mud etc.
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby weelz58 » 14 Dec 2019, 22:40

First I want to thank everyone here who took the time to read my long diatribe and respond to my post and questions about the Frontier V6 MWD power chair.

Irving - Thank you for giving me the info on the different RNet controllers and the different amperage's that are available. Also thank you for giving me a heads up on a cheaper way around a USB/12V adapter that can be gotten on eBay.

Dan - So you are saying that the only option that Frontier offers is an 80A controller? If I was to upgrade, you say that it voids the warranty. Would that basically mean I would have to go buy separately a 120A RNet controller and swap it out? Is it that easy even though it voids the warranty?

Also, where did you get the better tires from and did they fit the stock rims for both the drive wheels and casters or did you have to get different rims as well?

When swapping out wheels, either drive wheels or casters, especially if they are different sizes, does the chair stay level without having to adjust anything or is there some adjustment that needs to be done manually?

Malcolm - Thank you for your experience and input as well. Especially about trying the 80A controller first to see if I would really need anything beefier.

Burgerman - Thank you for providing your technical expertise on how to get the best performance out of this chair and electronics. I will PM you regarding my specific situation and if/how the better programmer that you talk about would be of any help to me.

Again, Burgerman, thank you for putting together and maintaining such an awesome resource for us folks who use powered mobility devices in order to make our daily life more independent.

Andy
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby weelz58 » 14 Dec 2019, 22:42

Dan - Obviously I would have to reprogram the new controller if I was to get one and swap it out. Forgot to mention that in fully realize that would have to be done. Thanks
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby Burgerman » 15 Dec 2019, 09:53

I think that to save money they do a special version with a cheaper controller, and a few other cost cutting measures so that it can be included in some funding catogory.

I was under the impression that I had seen a 120A version a long while back. But that was in the UK.
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Re: In The Process Of Applying For New Powerchair

Postby weelz58 » 15 Dec 2019, 19:43

Burgerman I bet you are 110% correct. The government Medicare system here in the US wants to try and cut corners and save money anywhere they can.
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