60ah ADD ON build with Pictures

[expresso]

Wrapping it up - the Tape lenny suggested is the tape i used on top - i needed much less than i expected to use - and i decided not to over wrap the whole pack in this tape -

i feel its a bit overkill giving that it will sit in a plastic box with some foam padding on the sides etc, - i hope i never have to take this apart - it will be a nightmare trying to remove all the tape -

getting there - half assed but moving along --

[expresso]

Pack looks good!

thanks - i could really use this extra 60ah now that my main chair is needing repairs - using my backup chair with lead - and 30ah ADD ON - its okish - not great but much better than with out the ADD ON for sure - just to get around the city is fine -

Hopefully i should get my New Chair in August - and have my Main Chair repaired by then also - if all goes well -

[expresso]

Almost there - had a few issues of course - all cabling is done - have to screw them down and test first - - will discharge some and then recharge

last of the cabling done

[Burgerman]

You should start a small part time hobby business.

[expresso]

You should start a small part time hobby business.

IF i give them away - they will take it and love it and agree with all the benefits etc, - once money is involved - no one wants it - or dont really need it - etc, etc, - i gave up trying to explain the benefits - - and the few i asked about there chair battery life - all say its great - they last a long time - going on two years and still always in the green -

not surprised i hear it all the time - most dont use the chair the way i do or many of us do on here - most cant pay for this kind of setup we do - then the PL8 and PSU etc, and so - once they hear all this - and they say there lead is fine anyway - and get them for free anyway - i be out of business before i even start

and i am not perfect - my wrapping - packing etc, not going to win any contests thats for sure - BUT - they work and thats the most important of it all - -

i am getting near the end - wiring cable all done - box is done - i need to connect all my cabling and make the Charge Cable which is the most time consuming - i have to prep everything first maybe tomorrow and then try it on thursday - if all goes well - i should be testing it on the bench at least this weekend - if it passes -

then on the chair next week hopefully - to be honest - i am not crazy about the wiring connectors i made - the ring terminal and wiring thickness wasnt a good match - i made it work with some solder also - being an ADD ON and not going inside the chair - i let it go for now if it works - or else will redo better just the connectors

some more pics - you can see the size overall isnt that big -

[expresso]

few more

[expresso]

Coming from a full pack 135ah chair to just an ADD ON Chair - i have to say - its very limited - i hope to gain a bit more with this 60ah instead of the 30ah thats on it now - if these Cells work out good - i would say if anyone is considering an ADD ON - make it 60ah at least - to make a difference -

Headways - the most i can fit in this space is 45ah - 3 Rows of 15ah Cells - - i only stopped at this 60ah cell because of the height - i wanted to be able to close it - or else i was even considering a 75ah cell i found which would have fitted perfect length wise - with no extending the box - but the height was higher - and of course a few more pounds also -

this was shipped to me at 28 pounds - so its about that weight when all done - not too bad - about 5 pounds over the headways - there were stated to be 5C constant - and 15C peak - IF those specs are true - who knows -

[steves1977uk]

expresso, you need to get your ass over to the UK and help me make my charge cable! I have all the parts, but my Brother finds it hard to solder on the small D-Sub pins He tried to do it but managed to melt the plastic where the pins are held, so hasn't tried again.

Steve

[Burgerman]

USE PLENTY OF LIGHT!
+
Quality thermostatic iron set to 350C with small tip that is CLEAN and tinned ready to go!

Tin each connectors pin with small amount solder. 2 seconds per pin.
Tin the end of each bared fluxed cable, 2mm insulation stripped, also 1 to 2 seconds.
Using big lumps of bluetack on the bench, to hold one wire in place at a time, heat only as long as it takes for the solder already applied to the connector and wire to melt and go shiny, about 2 secs each one.

Only hard part, my eyes are 58.

[expresso]

expresso, you need to get your ass over to the UK and help me make my charge cable! I have all the parts, but my Brother finds it hard to solder on the small D-Sub pins He tried to do it but managed to melt the plastic where the pins are held, so hasn't tried again.

Steve

if i were close to you - no problem - and that has happened to me also at the start when i was learning - and can still happen - i have to make another for this one now - and already thinking it over in my head what i can do to not let that happen - or have the solder touch each other - - tomorrow i will do the prep work for the charge cable - solder the pins in the DSub - tin the wires - cut to size - heat shrink ready cut to size - nylon sleeving - etc, - if i can get that much done tomorrow i be happy - working with a new girl - first time helping me with this stuff so - i dont want to rush - then thursday - all prep work done - i can make it hopefully -

i managed to kill two of them at the start - since then - i managed to make 2 more - that are working - after this one - i will make another back up charge cable on the PL 8 side - just to have ready in case - i rely on my Pl 8 alot now - two are in use most all the time at once when charging the full pack chair - one spare in the closet with spare PSU 24v - i cant do without now - i rather be safe then sorry -

in total i made 5 working cables all in use - this is my 6th if all goes well -

[Burgerman]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8023&start=80#p121619

[snaker]

I have all the parts, but my Brother finds it hard to solder on the small D-Sub pins He tried to do it but managed to melt the plastic where the pins are held, so hasn't tried again.

My dad was scared while being told to solder DSub. I bought a load of 20 DB9s (just $1) for him practice. He completely ruined 5 first ones, the 6th got better and from the 8th all looked good. Then he switched to solder the mixed DB13W3s, everything were fine although he still ruined one DB13W3 due to his weak eyes. Now he is addicted to soldering and happy to help friends, neighbors in soldering for ... free Maybe you can apply this experience to your brother. Do not stress him, let him have some fun in soldering.

[expresso]

yes takes time and i learned the same way -

i didnt think i was going to make it - till about after the 2nd week of trying - and finally found a way that worked for me

from this

[expresso]

to this -

still makes me nervous each time i have to do it -

[shirley_hkg]

Box cut has no strength at all.

Your add-on deserves a better case really .

Just a cup of espresso or two . Nice & waterproof ...

[expresso]

i agree with that for sure - its not the greatest solution - the only reason it works is because it will sit in a backpack also - i dont like it either -

this was the first thing i found when i first started with the headways and closet size plastic etc, and it fits in the backpack also - so i got it and then realized i had to extend it - so i did a chop shop job - not happy about it but works -

those boxes you find - i cant find anything here - maybe i am not looking good enough - and just settled on what i already know works but not clean or pretty etc,

what i did was cut two boxes and added the extra i needed - but i left the bottom part of the extended part to fit inside the whole box also - so with the battery in there - its holding the small extended part also - i taped it of course - but its not just the tape alone holding it together

sort of a box inside a box - the bottom layer

[LROBBINS]

Those boxes are quite common in Europe. I suppose that in the U.S. electrical panels and boxes are still mostly steel, but here it's all (or nearly) done in polycarbonate.

[hobie1dog]

Expresso-I didn't see in your first post any link to the place where you got your cells, can you do that for us/me?

Thanks

[expresso]

Expresso-I didn't see in your first post any link to the place where you got your cells, can you do that for us/me?

Thanks

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pc-Lif ... 81787.html

these are the ones i got - i left a 3 star review because of missing connectors i was asking for before and during the time i placed my order -
emailing back and forth is a bit of a pain if you want to ask a question - you may get an answer half ass and then have to ask again because it dosnt make any sense -

thats a pain to deal with - but other than that - it was shipped UPS and arrived in a few weeks - at no extra charge to me - since i picked free shipping - i wasnt expecting them so fast - for some reason they upgraded it to UPS - i think they had a problem shipping them the free way - either way - it worked for me

[expresso]

All Done - recharging and i notice that Cell 3 is not up to the rest of the pack - so its a setback - i am not fully surprised to be honest - i feel its the connectors i made -

i checked all bolts - all tight - i have to remake the connectors with larger wire 8 AWG and replace and retest - thats the only thing it can be other than a bad cell which isnt off the table either -

[expresso]

the charge cable went smooth this time - i think best i done - and i feel its because i did it in two days - one day for prepping and get it all ready - next day to actually do it -

this will set me back another week now - and all because of the connectors - if they shipped them with the cells -- i am pretty sure it would have been fine

i need a connector about 110mm long - 3mm thick and about 75mm bolt spacing -- i emailed the seller twice for them already - and no response yet

thats the downside of dealing with overseas - but other than this setback - pack looks nice -

[expresso]

BM what do you think ?

at first i though it was cell 3 the bad one - now i see cell 6 is actually worse

this is the first charge as a whole pack 60ah -

do you think i need to redo the connectors ? i dont want to use this pack unless its done right - if i have to remake the connectors - i want to do that first

do you think i should discharge all the way to 2.9 and recharge again to decide? or just make new connectors ?

[snaker]

I had the same issue, it was just due to loose balance ring terminals. My experience is that all graph lines should be smooth. If any line is not smooth, check BOTH terminals on that cell. In your graphs, it seems you need to tighten all ring terminals.

Did you use your own nuts/washers or the original ones that came with the cells? If you used the original ones, check if they are stainless? Mine were terrible and stained, I had to replace them by inox ones.

[expresso]

i want to give it another chance - i had to make my own connectors - i used my own flat washers and lock washers - everything is tight -

this is the very first recharge after i was done - i will discharge it again tomorrow and recharge it again to see - the only thing it can be is my connectors - which where not the best - i can do better and wish i did - if the next graph isnt better - i will redo my connectors - its either the connectors or the Cells -

the connectors i can redo - the cells - i am out of luck if thats the case - i give it another chance tomorrow - before i redo the connectors

[expresso]

one more try tomorrow before i decide what i will do -

[shirley_hkg]

Nothing to do with loose connection .

They are pouch cells inside , and they are old .

It resembles the patterns of my A123 pouch pack .
https://www.wheelchairdriver.com/board/ ... start=3280

[expresso]

Nothing to do with loose connection .

They are pouch cells inside , and they are old .

It resembles the patterns of my A123 pouch pack .
https://www.wheelchairdriver.com/board/ ... start=3280

I think your right - i get the feeling its the Cells themselves - i will redo my connectors anyway because i just need to know for myself but i am not expecting it to change the outcome -

getting all excited to have a 60ah ADD ON - which i need right now - that i made bad choices purchasing these i believe - Headways are the best safest bet still with Cells i believe now - having a 45ah Headway would have been better -

lesson learned - what i should have done is just get 8 more headways and add to the 30ah i have - i may do just that anyway now -

i will continue to try to make it work when all said and done - and just use it till the end - which may not be long now - too bad its may not work out - would have been great to have 60ah in the same space -

amateur mistake - will be extra careful from now on -

[Burgerman]

Just charge a few times. Discharge about 15Ah out. Then recharge a few times. They should get better?

Yes maybe suspect cells. What was the feedback like?

[expresso]

Just charge a few times. Discharge about 15Ah out. Then recharge a few times. They should get better?

Yes maybe suspect cells. What was the feedback like?

none - haha - i was the first sucker - i went with these because of the 5C rating believing it would be better and was told they were new cells - so who knows - i will make the connectors over either way but not expecting much - i also may move the balance ring to the bottom because the flat washer i have is a bit larger OD than i wanted - it sits on the other ring terminals better -

i have it on top of the first ring terminal now with lock washer over it - when i change out the connector i will try to get a better fit

[shirley_hkg]

Relax .
Add-on doesn't need to work very hard , ten..ish amp most of the time . It will do 7 years quite well.

My first pack , 40A add-on back in 2007, last 5 years , retired in pretty good shape still .