Muslims and why Trump is right

[Sully]

Keeping religion out of all this, in keeping with a 40 hour work week presumably Saturday and Sunday, it is quite handy to have days like that for keeping you mind and body straight.

They are days when the majority of folks can get together, go fishing, or get involved in all sorts of recreational efforts together or apart whatever trips your trigger. For me Sunday was the family kind of day with Saturday being the "Honey do" day. Of y'all who don't have the experience of having a spouse who pretty much governs your free time, probably don't give much credence to such things.

[Burgerman]

If society wants a weekend off and shuts everything sundays thats fine. Majority rules. But not whan religous nuts dictate it!

[Lord Chatterley]

On the anniversary of the attempted massacre in Garland.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2016/05/03/anniversary-first-islamic-state-attack-american-soil-war-just-begun/

LC

[Burgerman]

And all the lefties and other non sane (religious) people just ignore it.

[Burgerman]

And all the lefties and other non sane (religious) people just ignore it and cannot say religion is the cause. Its only extremists. They dont get that all religion is extreme if you actually believe it!

[Lord Chatterley]

If society wants a weekend off and shuts everything sundays thats fine. Majority rules. But not whan religous nuts dictate it!

It ain't fine by me - if I want to buy a bacon sandwich and a bottle of plonk on a Sunday morning and someone else wants to sell me a bacon sandwich and a bottle of plonk on a Sunday morning where does any majority get the right to intervene?

LC

[Burgerman]

Because thats how societies rules come about. We vote in polititions to make these decisions/laws for us.

Where I disagree is when its done because of some fruit cakes religous belief.

[Burgerman]

If I got into power tomorrow I would shut all churches and allow them to be opened up as pubs.

And ban religion, football, deport all muslims in 28 days...
Next would be child support/benefits, and housing benefit.

[Lord Chatterley]

Because thats how societies rules come about. We vote in polititions to make these decisions/laws for us.

And where do the laws of reality fit into this equation?

Suppose the voters elect politicians who decide to make laws at odds with laws of supply and demand, for example.

Is that okay?

LC

[Burgerman]

It is if they dont get voted out...

[sacharlie]

Laws at odds with supply and demand result in many peasants.

[Burgerman]

Yes true. But those in command are given the power to do that by the ignorant masses. We allow them to do this.

The fact that most do not make the right decisions to produce the strongest economy is unfortunate. To me its black and white. You need a relatively free capitalist economy, with a well controlled safety net for those that deserve it. And not the rest. You must manufacture or increase value and sell to the countries around you to get richer. And not the opposite! Likewise, having the bulk of working people all selling things to each other doesent make the country richer. Its just running around swapping stuff...

A country thats rich has no problem helping the disadvantaged. A comunistic socialist government is fairer on the face of it to the ignorant masses, but makes everyone poor. So the dissadvantaged actually do less well in the end when theres nothing left like all the communist countries, east germany, etc.

[sacharlie]

having the bulk of working people all selling things to each other doesent make the country richer. Its just running around swapping stuff...

That is the great service economy which the WEST has become. Anyone up for a hamburger?

[Burgerman]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... /85785254/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kwuYVU2zBE bbc news
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qST2203TGIU

Its not an act of terrorism. Its not "extremists". But nobody in the west will really say it. Its an act of the muslim religion. As instructed by every koran.

Vote trump. Kick out muslims.

The gun lobby say the answer here is MORE GUNS!

Trump: I was right about attacks

In an emailed statement, Mr Trump criticised Mr Obama and Mrs Clinton for not saying the words "radical Islam" in their respective statements.

He even called for Mr Obama to step down and Mrs Clinton to leave the presidential race over it.

The presumptive Republican nominee also alleged that hundreds "of migrants and their children" were "implicated in terrorism" since 9/11.

"If we do not get tough and smart real fast, we are not going to have a country anymore. Because our leaders are weak, I said this was going to happen – and it is only going to get worse."

Trump says he will add comments on the Orlando shooting to his previously scheduled speech on Monday

[Lord Chatterley]

Yes true. But those in command are given the power to do that by the ignorant masses. We allow them to do this.

This was one of the biggest differences between Ludwig von Mises [the 20th.c. greatest economist] and Ayn Rand [the 20th.c. greatest philosopher] .

Von Mises said - like Plato - that ordinary people were too thick to understand the truths of economics whereas Ayn Rand said the truth was a species of the real and ordinary people COULD discern and act in accordance to the laws of reality providing they were not forcefully mislead.

On economics Von Mises and Rand are almost identical but Rand was an optimist - not a pessimist like Von Mises.

It is interesting to me that ordinary people in this country favour Brexit and view religion and global warming as a hoax.

LC

[Burgerman]

Real scientists will tell you that global warming (and cooling) is very real.
The real question is:

1. Is any of it caused by us, and if so how much?
2. Is it a bad thing? Theres a LOT of evidence to show quite the contrary.

Right now theres been 12 to 14 years of no change, contrary to all the "models" prediction. And contrary to all the models we are not under water as predicted 15 years back, or close to it. So the truth is somewhere in between the bullshit exadurated hype, and that its all a hoax.

But since we are powerless right now to do anything anyway, without causing masssive problems with food production, heat etc then we should be more worried about if its really a bad thing. Because it appears that its quite the opposite.

[Sully]

I will not discuss Trump, except to cay he epitomizes everything I despise in a human being. and for another thing he is a Real Estate Salesman, they never tell anything resembling the truth, just what suits the moment. OK I got that off my shoulders. NOW----

Global Warming, Back about 30 or so years ago, there was a bunch of "so called" scientists were pushing the idea of an imminent Ice Age! Why ? Well--for the same reasons the current herd say is causing this Warming. I do understand that something is happening, in fact this planet and its atmosphere is always in some sort of flux. The entire galaxy is as well. If in fact "we" humans are to blame, we are likely 100 years, or more, too late to effect a reasonably effective change.

If we look at the earth at its life span, civilization of Humans has been here just a moment or a blink of that time. And it there have been more than a few ice ages as well as warming periods. Alaska was in a temperate zone for quite a few millennium. How do we suppose that came about? The Sciences were developed because certain facts were proven reproduce able. Most of the facts around this phenomenon haven't been reproduced to my knowledge, it is all conjecture.

[Burgerman]

Its actually all computer models. Using the exact same software, and exact same input variables that cant predict the weather a week away.

And 15 years ago these models predicted that by now we would be much warmer, and flooded, and all kinds of catastrophic problems. Which hasnt happened... Which should have proven that the models dont work. But that is ignored. It doesent fit what the envoiromentalists want to see.

Weather and climate is a massively complex intereacting system. Look up chaos theory. A seemingly unimportant miniscule inaccuracy in one of the input parameters or input data results in a wildly disproportionate change in the end results. And we dont even know what the parameters really are, or what inputs we need.. The only way a computer model can tell the real future is if:

We understood the exact affect of every different thing on everything else. For eg gamma rays on clouds... And we really dont! And we ont even know what things we actually need to consider.

In chaos theory the infamous butterfly flapping its wings really can cause a huge cyclone. So we would need to know about evey butterfly. Or rather every atom and molecule. In order to give a reliable prediction. And thats just not possible.

And who says warmer is bad?

Then theres this: http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/warming.pdf

[Lord Chatterley]

Saudi Arabia - wikileaks exposes the source of global terror-

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/22/world/europe/how-the-saudis-turned-kosovo-into-fertile-ground-for-isis.html?smid=tw-share&_r=0

LC

[Burgerman]

Summary of very long page. Religous people are crazy and the result of the desease is suffering and death and way. Wipe it out.

[Lord Chatterley]

Summary of very long page. Religous people are crazy and the result of the desease is suffering and death and way. Wipe it out.

If you study the various religions you will find there a very striking peculiarity about Islam. In all other religions their texts describe how to be a good Christian, or Jew or whatever but Islam is very different - most of it's laws are not about Islam or Muslims but about me - the infidel, the kaffir, and how I should be suppressed and humiliated.

It is rather troubling therefore when Imams begin proclaiming “The Prophet Muhammad says that if someone has a chance to take part in jihad and doesn’t, he will die with great sins.” and “The blood of infidels is the best drink for us Muslims.”

LC

[Burgerman]

True.

In all other religions their texts describe how to be a good Christian

But only after it has been "re-interpreted" for them... Its actually a very evil book (bible).

Most religion books say similar things. Its just that as time went on people dont actually read it, they all say they do, and they really dont. They listen to the nice bits as "translated" for them by "scollars" or in church or on TV from the plain english that we can all read, to some fancy tap dancing that claims it all means something else and its some metaphor or some other bollox for each slavery, stoning, murdering of eneies, killing your unrully kids, giving your underage daugter to your house guests, etc etc etc... Its all in there. Very clearly. And not in the first testement that they all claim we should ignore...

The real difference is that muslims are new. And have not yet learned to translate it into freindly loving bullshit that the xstians all now claim.
(even though they are burning people alive - take a look on wiki leaks and watch if you dare - and banging nails into childrens heads because the bible says they are witches and that you shouldnt suffer a witch to live. Talk about nice xstians!)

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-enter ... 63381.html

The difference is that they havent learned to tap dance around it yet. There are sane people and religous people. A massively harmful self propagating mental desease. Theres no in between. Religion, and all belief systems that are not evidence based should be humiliated and have the piss taken from it at every opportunity.

People with imaginary freinds are irrational. Dangerous. Cause trouble like we saw in northern island, egypt, india, middle east, israel, and almost every part of the planet. And always has because they cannot keep this harmful garbage to themselves. It certainly deserves no special "respect" over any other kind of imaginary freind, which is what they all claim! You shouldnt be rude about it!

[Lord Chatterley]

I agree that the Bible is insane but that article in The Independent is deliberately designed to deceive.

Firstly, there is a huge difference between the tone and substance of the Old and New Testaments. The Old Testament is a collection of scribblings by a bunch of genocidal maniacs who worship a psychopathic God whose traditional laws in the Talmud grants them special privilege and powers to deceive, rob and kill non-Jews. It's probably worse than the Koran but fortunately, virtually all Jews consider the old laws to be insane and they are no longer recognised.

Jesus obviously rejected the old Jewish laws and was more of a pacific and less xenophobic personality - there is violence in the New Testament but it is conducted mainly by imaginary characters, and Prots generally reject miracles as a thing of the Biblical past.

The Koran is actually worse than the New Testament in my opinion, but that's hardly the point because the Koran is only a fraction of Islam - the largest texts are the Sunna - the traditions, laws and biography of Mohammed and they are full of violence and oppression - not by imaginary characters - but by alleged human beings - and miracles are absolutely intrinsic to every day life.

This is a problem because it creates a sort of chaotic world view in which killing is considered an appropriate action of perfect human beings.

As for Africa - I wouldn't put all the blame on Christians as there aren't any witches in the New Testament.

Christians should take some of the blame definitely, but the real problem there is Africa's native religion - animism - the Stone Age doctrine that regards the environment - rocks, trees,rivers etc., as living entities.
It's not until you read some of the first-hand accounts of Christian missionaries in the third world that you get some idea of how awful animism was: when a chief died they would bury all his living servants with him, for example.

Of course there is no excuse for any religion today - the sooner it dies out the better.

LC

[Burgerman]

Firstly, there is a huge difference between the tone and substance of the Old and New Testaments. The Old Testament is a collection of scribblings by a bunch of genocidal maniacs who worship a psychopathic God whose traditional laws in the Talmud grants them special privilege and powers to deceive, rob and kill non-Jews. It's probably worse than the Koran but fortunately, virtually all Jews consider the old laws to be insane and they are no longer recognised.

First, the old/new testement is all in the precious book. They cant just choose to ignore the old testement because it suits them, because the whole basis of their stupid religon eg stuff like the very "commandments" and the witches thing, and the very basis of their supposed cuddly nice morality, their daft creation stories that they are still pushing to get taught in schools, (and yes the adam and eve stuff) that is the whole reason for the jesus part of the book, (the bit where he sacrifices himself, to himself, to make up for the guilt that adam and eve caused by eating an apple that he put there in full knowledge that adam would eat it making him the guilty one!) and 101 other stupid things that they all claim as being true, are all in that first testement that they now choose to (selectively) ignore when it suits. Tap dancing?

And the other things I mentioned in the previous post above are not even IN the old testement anyway!

[Lord Chatterley]

Apparently, the Prots made a big deal about Jesus being the Messiah.
His alleged return is suppose to usher in New Era - exculpation from Original Sin, no miracles, no religious law and no Old Testament traditions.
Papists said what you said - you can't just pick and choose but the Prots reckoned otherwise. They said God would not have given us reason if he didn't want us to use it.
So the Papists launched another war of extermination against them [as they did against the Lollards and Cathars] called - The Thirty Years War - which still continues in Northern Ireland.

But the Prots narrowly managed to survive - it was a close run thing - but reason got out into the world and the rest, as they say, is history.

Can this happen to Islam?

I doubt it.

LC

[Burgerman]

They said God would not have given us reason if he didn't want us to use it.

Well he gave us "free choice" apparently... The apple or not is an example. Omniscience entails foreknowledge. So he cant have it both ways!

If free will is real he cant know the future, if its not then he can, and the apple was just another example of him being a total bastard...

Argument from the impossibility of omniscience and free will:

God is omniscient
God has a free will
Entities with free will have non-determinate futures
Omniscience entails foreknowledge
If an entity knows the future, the future is not non-determinate

[Lord Chatterley]

They said God would not have given us reason if he didn't want us to use it.

Well he gave us "free choice" apparently... The apple or not is an example. Omniscience entails foreknowledge. So he cant have it both ways!

Good luck sorting God out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_in_theology

LC

[Burgerman]

Well you cant sort out illogic. Only stamp it out!

[Burgerman]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... k-istanbul

Heres some more religion for you. The religion of piece(s)... Islam shows what it really is again.

Three attackers arrived in a taxi and began firing at the terminal entrance late on Tuesday. They blew themselves up after police fired back.

Officials earlier said 239 people were injured, with 41 still intensive care.

PM Binali Yildirim said early signs pointed to so-called Islamic State.

However, no-one has so far admitted carrying out the attack.

How dangerous is Turkey's unrest?
Reaction to the attack
#PrayForTurkey: Show of solidarity after Istanbul attack
How to secure airports from attacks?
Turkey caught in overlapping security crises

#PrayForTurkey: Show of solidarity after Istanbul attack

And still they dont see the hypocracy!

[Lord Chatterley]

Americans will find this interesting - so do we all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbkS26PX4rc

LC