PINNED - Lithium battery conversion/info

[expresso]

yeah that is strange - its common also - with other things for some reason - those links would work also - but again - shipping would be the factor - when summer comes around - i will stop by a few bike shops here - and ask about that - just curious -

it could also be that here in the US - Electric bikes are not a big thing - here in the city - we have alot of electric bikes for delivery guys - so they must be getting there battery packs from some where here i would think - but they may not be headway cells in there -

either way it is strange that NO ONE in the US Sells them here - - wonder why the only place in the US decided to stop selling them also - besides if you want to buy 500 at a time -

[Burgerman]

Probably only want to sell to companies or people that are not DIY. Go on any ebike or ev diy forum and the amount of carnage and dead cells, packs that dont work properly, or that last weeks is huge. They probably decide that its not worth all the returns, claims etc. All stems from user ignorance. From too high C rates, bad wiring, dumb BMS issues, and bad initial assembly from the typical dummy that thinks its easy.

[shirley_hkg]

45Ah add-on .

[expresso]

nice - now that you got the PL 8 - why didnt you just make it without the BMS connected - use the PL 8 to charge and balance -

[ex-Gooserider]

OK, it looks like the 90Ah pack, using 24 15AH 40152S Headway cells, arranged vertically in each box, wired 4s6P is about the best I can do with the stock battery boxes....

Given that, does this seem like the right shopping list to look for pricing on batteries and such (I can get the bolts and such elsewhere, and locally)

48 X 40152S Headway Cells
50 X 41052 size 2-cell holders (only need 48, but to have spares?)
100 X 41052 size 2-hole bus bars (probably more than I need, but...)

---------
Aside from Evassemble, any other vendors that have been noticeably good or bad in ordering stuff for US delivery? I've been doing some shopping, based on a quick search for Headway vendors - and have found at least one place that is cheaper than Evassemble when adding in shipping costs... I have several other places I'm considering asking for quotes....

Does anyone know if there would also be a hit from US Customs? If so, any guess about amount?

---------------

FWIW, a couple of notes on Headway Headquarters - They have the announcement about wholesale only on their battery cell page, with no pricing, but they still list bus-bars, holders and so on with prices in the accessory / clearance pages, so you MIGHT still be able to get those things from them.

I also took them up on their offer to provide a referral to a 'reputable Chinese source' and got the following response:

Thank-you for your inquiry, we are happy to provide you with a reputable source in China (as of now there is no current sales in North America for Headway cells) to obtain quality Grade A cells. We have worked with Michelle Lu since before we started Headway-Headquarters, LLC, have attented Electric Vehicle Symposiums with her and other memebers of the Headway sales staff and have worked with her exclusively for our cells and will continue to do so. Michelle has left Headway and now works for Boka Energy Technologoy, Co. Ltd. as their Headway cell specialists due to her experience and expertise in not only selling Headway cells, but also in working directly for Headway for many years. She understands and is proficient in not only sales and specifications, but also the manufacturing, testing and packaging of the Headway brand cells. Her direct email address is <bote_2014@163.com> bote_2014@163.com, and please let her know that her information was passed on by Jim and Patricia at Headway-Headquarters.

ex-Gooserider

[Burgerman]

48 X 40152S Headway Cells
50 X 41052 size 2-cell holders (only need 48, but to have spares?)
100 X 41052 size 2-hole bus bars (probably more than I need, but...)

Cells OK.
As for cell holders I have no idea how its possible but I never seemto have enough.
As for 2 hole connectors, I dont know where they go. I always end up short by miles!

But its often far neater and better to use the 4 hole plates all over the place. Like here:

download/file.php?id=4286&mode=view big picture warning...

[Gnomatic]

48 X 40152S Headway Cells
50 X 41052 size 2-cell holders (only need 48, but to have spares?)
100 X 41052 size 2-hole bus bars (probably more than I need, but...)

Evassemble gives you enough free blocks and connecting plates, but it doesn't hurt to order a few extra.

http://www.evassemble.com/index.php?mai ... eiorrqdq75


"Free accessaries: 1xholder 1xconnecting plate. Make a remark in your purchase if you need four holes connecting plate(2pcs 2holes connecting plate will exchange to 1 pcs 4 holes connecting plate)"

These pics are courtesy of expresso

For a 90Ah pack out of 15Ah cells, here's a top view



... and a bottom view ...



That equates to 35 four hole spacers ...

[ex-Gooserider]

Thanks for the photos, useful for doing my layout - though I will have to do two smaller packs rather than the single large one like Expresso - he has a single big compartment, I have two boxes...

However I agree it looks like I could use a lot of the 4-hole plates instead of 2-hole plates. Easy if I go with Evassemble, might be necessary to look at changing the order and re-pricing it if I go to someone else...

Of course, given the stuff I have at the Asylum, not a big problem to make more plates if I run out...

Haven't looked at it yet, but I do have at least one response from Ali Baba - will see what they offer.

A couple of minor questions...

1. Interesting photo of your pack BM, but I was wondering if there was a reason you seem to often connect between 4-hole plates with 2-hole plates instead of just over-lapping them the way Expresso did on his pack?

2. It seems like the number of things under a screw-head can vary - from just one plate, to several plates and a balance wire terminal... Is there any need to adjust the length of the screws to compensate?

ex-Gooserider

[Burgerman]

Yes, I used what I had. As I say, no amount of counting and planing ever seems to add up! I never order enough plates/bars!

I used the bolts they now supply.

[expresso]

BM - i was thinking of using the lock washers which the Cells come with instead of locktite when making the 45ah ADD ON pack -

should it be Ok or any real issues or reasons for not using the lock washers ? on the full pack inside the chair - i used Locktite -

i also did for the first ADD ON - and when i had to redo a few things - had to reapply it etc, - i figure ifs it no big deal - at least for a small ADD ON - external pack

i would save the trouble of using the locktite - - what do you think ?

thanks

[Burgerman]

I would use loctite...

[expresso]

I would use loctite...

Ok - Loctite it is then - i rather do it right and once than having to redo it - this time i will add an extra cable with XT90 end for maybe adding something down the line - like a horn or lights etc, - which i can run off the ADD ON -

[ex-Gooserider]

I agree, Loctite, but I'd also be inclined to use lock washers as well, preferably a 'star' type rather than a split washer....

The theory at least is that the washers improve the electrical contact by scratching through any oxides or other crap, and making a very tight connection by the pressure of the washer against the bolt and surface material... The star type is preferred for electrical work because it has more distributed points of contact.

ex-Gooserider

[expresso]

i only considered it because its a ADD ON pack - not going inside a chair - i do like the star ones also - seem to have a better grip - i am not going to go out of the way to buy anything else - i figure they already come with the washers etc, - one less step to do and wont be messy - easier to remove if changing wires etc, - but then once its done - should be done - and not have to touch it either way -

[expresso]

http://www.usastore.revolectrix.com/Bargains/Like-New

[Gnomatic]

Well, my cells have been sitting over 60 days and today I decided to top them off and measure the static discharge. Right out of the gate, I gubered things up. Cell 01 had just finished charging and I wanted to get Cell 02 going ASAP. Also had to take my dog out quick.

So I didn't write down the mAh returned for Cell 01, I was distracted, figuring that the mAh returned info would be retained in the .CP8 file for that cell. However, all I'm seeing from the .CP8 file for Cell 01 are the graphs.

What are my options here? I don't want to wait another 60 days and start over after I get the rest of these topped off in the next day or two.

[expresso]

by any chance did you purchase a few extra cells ?


if you did - you can keep going and use those instead - hopefully BM can be of more help here -

[Burgerman]

It shows 101mAh returned.

You guys all need to go on computer driving lessons. 9.6 mins and returned 101mAh before the termination current was reached.

[expresso]

Nice - for some reason i open my PL 8 software and try to open that file and everything just closes when i do - strange - on desktop - not connected to the PL 8 etc, -
would that make a difference ?

[Burgerman]

Nice - for some reason i open my PL 8 software and try to open that file and everything just closes when i do - strange - on desktop - not connected to the PL 8 etc, -
would that make a difference ?.

Nope!

You guys all need to go on computer driving lessons. 9.6 mins and returned 101mAh before the termination current was reached.

I rest my case!

[Burgerman]

Espresso. Let me guess. You have your computer set up in retard dummy mode?, so you cant see file extensions?, and you have not removed the HIDDEN .zip from the file name because you cant see that! (Not sure you are safe to use a PC alone!)

Rename Cell01.CP8.zip to Cell01.CP8 and then choose OPEN GRAPH. Once you have configured your PC properly and it will open it. If not I have no clue what you are doing!

[Gnomatic]

It shows 101mAh returned.

Thanks BM. I could have sworn I had seen that info in the .CP8 files for the cells when I first charged up the cells. So it's the Pack Capacity vs. Time graph that I needed to look at for that info. I checked a few of them, but not that one, didn't see the info I was looking for and kinda panicked LOL

[expresso]

Espresso. Let me guess. You have your computer set up in retard dummy mode?, so you cant see file extensions?, and you have not removed the HIDDEN .zip from the file name because you cant see that! (Not sure you are safe to use a PC alone!)

Rename Cell01.CP8.zip to Cell01.CP8 and then choose OPEN GRAPH. Once you have configured your PC properly and it will open it. If not I have no clue what you are doing!

your right - haha - i am arranging to have you flown here to be by side all the time - this way i be sure to get everything done correctly - it was the Zip i didnt remove

wouldnt you love to visit NYC ? today was nice enough day for a spin - finally summer is near

[Burgerman]

I would be arrested.

But it was 19C here (about 70f?) and sunny. So apart from toothache (dont ask) today was nice. Been trying to sort out garden, drive, house, and catch up on 2 years neglect. Almost there. Also redecorating and new carpets. Busy time! Along with new PC. Then fix BM3, and finish green chair (just a fooplate) and then I will have 4 good but different chairs all ready to go! Should keep me going for a bit.

[steves1977uk]

That's the first thing I do, take Windows out of dummy mode! No wonder people get viruses and the likes because they think they're clicking on a pretty picture of a cat when really it's an executable virus!

Steve

[Burgerman]

Always set to see full path,
Menu's,
All file extensions for all types of files,
See hidden files and folders,
See hidden operating system files and folders,
Etc.
Then you must "set all folders to the same".

Then speed up the mouse, and change all the default programs to the correct ones, and then turn all that data/location/update/user info/sharing, data swapping stuff OFF, (takes about a week), get rid of all the metro aps asap, uninstall all the moving candy tiles, get rd of cortana, and other bullshit that wants to advertise or sell you something. After about 7 days the new win 10 is just an excellent operating system that you drive and use only YOUR software. And its free!

[expresso]

I would be arrested.

But it was 19C here (about 70f?) and sunny. So apart from toothache (dont ask) today was nice. Been trying to sort out garden, drive, house, and catch up on 2 years neglect. Almost there. Also redecorating and new carpets. Busy time! Along with new PC. Then fix BM3, and finish green chair (just a fooplate) and then I will have 4 good but different chairs all ready to go! Should keep me going for a bit.

you got alot going on there - busy - best thing to make the time go by - you wont like it here - i got a compliment on my chair today - tires etc,

i was riding and a biker was riding and liked my chair - the tires etc, etc, - i knew he wasnt from NY - turned out he was from Italy - Venice - living in Brooklyn and working in the city - i would have never guessed he was Italian -

if you were here - i would know from your accent - maybe one day you visit - never know - or i come visit you you love to have me around

[Burgerman]

I would be arrested first!

[expresso]

I would be arrested first!

why are you wanted here ? you seem like you wold be a nice friendly guy - come to NYC for a while - you wont leave friendly

[Burgerman]

It was a speed/roadblock/gun incident and ended as a bail jumping thing... They dont like me.