PL 8 - Q and A section - How to Set up - Use etc,

[steves1977uk]

Nope, unless you get a faulty one which expresso did, but he sent it back for a replacement. My first PL8 is 4+ years old and still works fine.

Steve

Do we need a spare or can we wing it with just one?

I have 2 so far, but might buy a couple more soon.

Stev

[Burgerman]

would you know for sure if and when they stop making them - so we can purchase another in case ?

No idea. But they have been around a lot longer than any other hobby charger.

[expresso]

Ok if anything you hear - let use know ASAP - i do have one spare but with all my chairs now needing the PL 8 - cant afford to not have at very least 2 working -

if its doing so good - they should just leave it alone or improve it

[Burgerman]

They did. They improve it by making it safer, more restricted in the choices and voltage limits, time limits, more checking. And remove the options that allow people to explode model planes and helicopters. But that makes the improved ones worse for us who require those choices and limits. Same reason most of the rest are useless to us. Not enough options, and no way to fine tune them to do what we need. And no decent PC software. Too many "error" boxes popping up etc.

What we need is a GOD preset. And we have close to that with the PL8 and a few behind the scenes adjustments... And firmware they changed to accommodate my objections on lead and on lifepo4 chemistries. It was useless before this. And it took about 18 months to get that sorted.
What we get in the newer versions is a dummy end user preset. more restrictive safe firmware, and no way to fix it.

[expresso]

not good - OK but since you have a relationship with them of some sort - they have listened to you on this - they can do the same for any new models - even before you have to ask them to do it ? or maybe they can make a charger to meet OUR needs - separate model ?

or just leave this one alone for US

[Scooterman]

I have 2 so far, but might buy a couple more soon.

Stev

I will get a spare one too Steve The one I've got is secondhand and might go kaput at any time. Then I will be

[steves1977uk]

The PL8 Touch should be getting a Win32 CCS app in the spring sometime (for us in the northern hemisphere), so hopefully it can be tweaked like the current CCS we use.

Steve

[Burgerman]

Possibly. But I suspect that its firmware will be more restrictive in regards timers, over or under voltage errors, cell count errors or 101 other things. Like the dual one.

[steves1977uk]

Then we need to get them to fix the firmware bugs BM! It might be our only choice if they decided to stop making the PL8v2.

Steve

[Burgerman]

They are not bugs. They are safety nazi careful choices.

For eg the nickel cadmium or metal hydride presets only allow 10A charge max. They are terrified someone may try and charge an AA cell at 40 amps... But I had a request from someone for a preset than could do much more. These were in an old iBot. So I did an unofficial preset that allows up to 40A on this chemistry with just CC and deltaV for him. Now the PL8s firmware doesent complain when you do that. The others do. One tiny example.

Another. The cells we use can be down to 2 volt and the stock PL8 presets wont charge if a cell group is that low. But I edit theat so we never get an error trying to rescue a pack. Likewise I edit the highest voltage per cell allowed before error or end charge, on the lead cells, and the same on low voltage startup. To reflect whatever we are trying to do. And the gap between highest cell and lowest used to be 150mV. Or safety charge at .5A kicked in. Thats fine on a small lipo. Absolutely pointless, and frustrating on a large lifepo4 pack. So I got them to edit that so that I can change it to 350mA and not be even used unless a cell gets to over our charge voltage so it never kicks in. Theres about 12 or 14 such tweaks on my presets to match their modified firmware that makes the PL8 work properly for lead, and for lifepo4. The others in the range dont do this. And other manufacturers are way worse! And no PC software. I suspect same problem on the newer bump charge ones. They are dumbed down in many ways. They wont tweak firware again, to suit a handful of battery freaks.

So the PL8 is about as good as it gets right now.

[Gnomatic]

I have a pair of PL8's.

Their newer charger has that bump controller built in, but that useful to us. I do like the LED screen and the fact that it has bluetooth.(not sure those alone are worth the $100 premium) Hopefully the Windows app and firmware for it have the desired flexibility. Or, at least, they are open to update those based on user input from BM like they did with the PL8v2.

[Burgerman]

Not much chance. They are most unhelpful, it took a year of screenshots and testing and not directly. Via beta testers and they are hard to work with. Most of the things we need, they claim makes it less safe so its a battle.

Safer = more restrictive. Simpler, and more suited to their dummy mainstream users.
Less safety nazi, more flexible, expanded options, etc many that are unseen, make it more useful to us, and less safe for the masses of idiots...

[Gnomatic]

Understand. And in my previous post I meant to say the built in bump controller on their new charger is NOT useful to us.

[Scooterman]

Cycling and Monitoring

Do lifepo4 cells periodically need cycling for good health and long life?

Monitoring - What is this, is it monitoring the cell/s voltage? Now why might one want to do that?

[Burgerman]

If not using a pack, lithium should be stored about half to two thirds full. so you would charge, which balances cells, then discharge to around 60 percent full. And store for 2 to 3 months max. Then repeat. There are many reasons to monitor. For e.g. to see how crap your lead mobility charger is and what it does.

[Scooterman]

If not using a pack, lithium should be stored about half to two thirds full. so you would charge, which balances cells, then discharge to around 60 percent full. And store for 2 to 3 months max. Then repeat.

I shall remember this. That is why expresso was going on about discharging his packs

There are many reasons to monitor. For e.g. to see how crap your lead mobility charger is and what it does.

Oh that’s clever. So you could hook up the PL8 in parallel with a LA charger and graph the charger voltage. Is that right?

[Burgerman]

Yep. You can also connect something like a inverter, and plug in a 1kw heater, or lights. And monoitor the pack so you dont over discharge a cell. Or check after a few months that all cells are at the same voltage and one group are not self discharging faster. Or any number of things.

[Scooterman]

Yep. You can also connect something like a inverter, and plug in a 1kw heater, or lights. And monoitor the pack so you dont over discharge a cell. Or check after a few months that all cells are at the same voltage and one group are not self discharging faster. Or any number of things.

I would never have thought of using the PL8 like that

“Learning all the time”

[Burgerman]

I spit on your blutac.

Mines bigger!

And more abused and dirty. Dirty blutec works better... My soldering iron is clean and tinned. Just did it.

[shirley_hkg]

Dirty blutec works better...

Yes . Too sticky when new .

[Scooterman]

To monitor what an XLR LA charger is doing. Do I just hook the these two balance wires to the pos and neg of the battery terminals?

And chose 'monitor ' cells on the PL8?

[steves1977uk]

You use the main charge leads on the PL8 SM Or you could use a XLR splitter cable eg. Male plug to 2 Female sockets, then plug the charger in one and the PL8 in the other.

Steve

[Scooterman]

Thank you Steve, much appreciated

[steves1977uk]

Similar to this... https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pulse-Female-X ... B00785CRSI But with thicker wires, say 2.5mm2 for less volt drop.

Steve

[steves1977uk]

Even 1.5mm2 wire would be ok to use and easier to fit in XLR plugs/sockets.

Steve

[Scooterman]

Can the PL8 be powered from a powerchair/mob scooter and used to monitor cell voltages "out in the field" so to speak?

[Burgerman]

Yep.

You can use it as the power supply and charge the chair or scooter as you drive too. But it wont help! Since you take more out than it puts back... But it amused the WCS guy Last seen scratching his head.

[Scooterman]

Yep.

You can use it as the power supply and charge the chair or scooter as you drive too. But it wont help! Since you take more out than it puts back... But it amused the WCS guy Last seen scratching his head.

Damn and there goes my perpetual motion machine idea

Re you lifepo4 presets, particularly the 100Ah and 200Ah ones.

Out of curiousity…. For a 100Ah cells in a 2P arrangement....

Would setting the 100Ah 'detection' tab to 2P achieve the same result as...

Leaving the 200Ah preset as is, i.e no parallel packs.

It looks that way to me, especially you previously mentioning the pl8 sees parallel cells as one larger cell.

learning all the time

[Scooterman]

Addition:

If a manual termination current value is set in a 2P preset, does the PL8 just double it? That's what I'm thinking?

[Scooterman]

Sorry one last question for today BM, hopefully.

Out of curiosity for lifepo4...

If the balance voltage was to be set lower than 3.5V it would achieve nothing except increasing the balancing time which would be an undesirable thing, me thinks....

PS if you can’t be arsed to reply (totally understandable) just pick me up if I’ve got the above/s wrong