Permobile F5 PM and JSM Bad Cable 7F00 Error

[swalker]

I am posting this so that if someone else comes across this problem they will know what it took to resolve it on my 2016 Permobil F5.

I went on a 14 mile ride 3 days ago and about 1/2 mile from the end The LCD display indicated a PM error for a Bad Cable (7F00).

I monitored this over the next day and noticed I was getting both PM and JSM Bad Cable 7F00 errors. This would be displayed every 5 seconds for 1 second, often alternating between the two different errors. The wheelchair was still functional, but it was throwing these two errors.

Today I got a chance to inspect the chair and discovered that one of the RNet cables was partially unplugged. The culprit was the cable going from the power module to an RNet junction box mounted near the power module. The cable was partially unplugged from the junction box. I plugged that back in and all seems to be working fine now.

Steve

[Marcelo]

Glad you got it sorted buddy, here's the tip.

[markQ700]

Just wanted to add that I am getting the same errors on my Quickie Q700m, so assume they use common controllers.

I'm having more than just loose cable issues so may start a new thread once I figure out what's going on. Just after I started seeing the codes, my chair would not even start up- the controller beeped, flashed once then died. I found that by unplugging the 5-button aux controller that the chair would at least start up, but still getting the PM/JSM Cable errors.

Thanks for your post!

,
m

[Burgerman]

If it were me and I have sorted many r-net errors for lots of people in the past - I would get a new bus cable that is the same as your longest one. And swap it with the 2 or 3 that your chair uses. One at a time obviously, and I am sure that this will find the bad cable if that is the issue. And it normally is. Also spray every bus cable contacts and in fact every connection on the chair, with deoxit. That should fix an error of that type. IF it doesent, then swap out each module in turn until the error goes away. You also need a programmer to swap out power modules.

Now since I have 3 complete r-net chairs, where everything is compatible and 3 complete spare r-net top of range systems sat on my shelf as spare parts that is trivially easy for me to say. If you only have one chair and or your backup one doesent use r-net then you are basically screwed. I never like to rely on others as they invariably turn ot to be useless or incompetant, unavailable, slow or expensive or have some other issues...

So I organise myself. Because the one thing you can garantee is that you WILL get a failure on a chair at some pont. Its not if, but when this happens. You cant ring an "engineer" at 9.30 on a sunday night when you are stranded miles from home. Even if you did he would likely want to take the chair away and order parts...

So you need these on a shelf labelled and pre programmed so your carer or family member can bring them to you. So you can fix i then and there! Same with complete wheels/tyres or fuses or whatever. This system has rescued me many times. And allowed me to do a permanant fix at home same hour/day.

But bus cable failures are common as they get knocked about, badly routed, oxidise due to humidity never mind salty roard in winter etc. Hence deoxit!

[Burgerman]

my chair would not even start up- the controller beeped, flashed once then died.

THAT sounds like a battery terinal, faulty breaker, loose connection (or someone has crimped it!) on a terminal on a battery, fuse, breaker, or a burned battery connector on the power module. Or a bus cable. A noisy electrical supply (bad connection) also manifests as a bad bus cable too. And going off completely is usually power.

A FEW MINS WITH A MULTIMETER will find all of those things.

A good logging meter like my fluke will show this noise/bad connection and high/low peaks even on the joystick charger port (XLR). But that wont find where it is. Just that there is a cable or connection issue.

[jefferso]

I went on a 14 mile ride 3 days ago and about 1/2 mile from the end The LCD display indicated a PM error for a Bad Cable (7F00).

I monitored this over the next day and noticed I was getting both PM and JSM Bad Cable 7F00 errors. This would be displayed every 5 seconds for 1 second, often alternating between the two different errors. The wheelchair was still functional, but it was throwing these two errors.

My ride was only 5.5 miles but it went over some pretty rough bumpy paths with lots of vibrations and I only got JSM Bad Cable 7F00 errors (I think) and not PM errors. It seems like the joystick cable on my 2022 F5 is one long cable from the Joystick controller all the way to the back and down inside into a junction box just under the plate the cushion rests on. A couple of the plugs there seemed loose (not sure which ones) and were pushed in firmly.

The error was showing up sporadically, so I can't be sure it's gone, but so far it hasn't appeared again since the re-seating of the plugs.

[jefferso]

Got the error again, so the slightly loose plugs were not the issue.

I had to have that cable replaced in September 2023, so maybe it's worn out again.

I'll have to see if I can figure out a way to test it.

[Burgerman]

Its telling you its the joystick cable. That means anyplace between the joystick and the power module. It may go straight to the power module or to the seating module and then to the power module (so 2 cables).

Just ebay a replacement. Get a few just in case. Can also be oxidised, use de-oxit at both ends.

[jefferso]

I'll have to figure out the length when I can get some help with this. Looks like it will be fairly long and one end will need to be with a 90° angle plug. One cable goes all the way from the joystick to a junction box on the back of the chair. From there it seems like another goes down along the standing/riser to inside the front of the chair. It's still sporadic. Right now it's not showing the error but if I move the joystick out on the swing away, sometimes it starts. So I'm guessing it's going to be this section.

Are those kinds of cables common on ebay in the UK? I don't see many. This ebay shop shows a few https://www.ebay.co.uk/str/solutionsmob ... ts/_i.html but no long ones with right angle connectors.

[Burgerman]

You can get a short one as used on my chairs. With right angle connector. Then it uses a longer one from the arm to wherever the power module is.

Its much better that way as lifting off a controller pod / arm or adding a programmer in the loop is all at your arm top.

Those short ones you can get from a sunrise dealer.

Or MAYBE here.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/157328053007
And every length between 10 and 30 quid.

Bought a box of cables - all lengths a couple of years ago. Maybe 15? for 30 quid... Job lot.

Long cable plus part 4:

[jefferso]

Hopeful post # 2. While trying to measure the length of the cable from the joystick to the junction box on the back of the chair, it seemed like maybe the cable plug under the joystick could be a little bit loose. After pushing in the plug firmly, no messages yet, but it hasn't been a few days yet. I would be very happy if that was the fix.

The cable seems to be about 112cm long from the joystick to the junction box. So it must be this cable listed on Permobil's parts site:

22.1 1831274 614692 CABLE, PJSM CONTROL PANEL R-NET, 1.5m, 90°

Maybe I won't need to replace it yet. But it would be nice if it was two cables, instead of one, with a plug easily accessible without having to use tools.

[Burgerman]

I admire your optimism!